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Concerns Over No PAE Kernel In Ubuntu 12.04 LTS

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  • #41
    Originally posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
    The issue could have been Canonical's patches to Xorg. Have you tried a less patch-happy distribution like Gentoo or Slackware?
    That's over and done with now, I no longer have a need for that, and the servers are officially e-waste. It was just a project I was working on to try and re-purpose some obsolete hardware.


    Originally posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
    According to that method of thinking, by the time that hardware has proper support, it is no longer current and support must be dropped.
    According to your method of thinking, GPU driver maintainers should have a vast array of 10-20 y/o hardware on hand, tested for every new patch, it's just not realistic. Regressions should be avoided as much as possible, but it's inevitable that older hardware will start to fall by the wayside. Out of the trillions of Pentium M machines that were sold, how many do you reckon are still running? I'd venture to guess not very many, most value-engineered laptops like Dell, etc... tend to crap themselves at about 4-5 years, if not earlier. For those few remaining stragglers, there's older versions of distros, which will probably run better anyways, since Pentium M doesn't have the GPU or CPU grunt to run any fancy new stuff anyways, it barely runs the old stuff.

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    • #42
      Originally posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
      You can bypass Canonical and go straight to upstream for new kernels. Checkout the sources and compile it. As long as you keep up to date with upstream, you should be fine.
      That is such a massive pain in the ass that it isn't even close to being funny.

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      • #43
        Originally posted by yogi_berra View Post
        That is such a massive pain in the ass that it isn't even close to being funny.
        In addition, upstream has been very clear on the point that if you want a well-tested kernel you should go with a vendor-supplied one. The vanilla kernel is deemed to be "good enough" with the expectation that someone with more resources, and a vested interest, will do the "road ready" testing. It's a setup that makes a great deal of sense. Kernel devs are not QA experts.

        To put it another way, you can drink from the clear spring. But you might end up with diarrhea. Vanilla kernels have not been put under the microscope.

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        • #44
          Originally posted by leeenux View Post
          Out of the trillions of Pentium M machines that were sold, how many do you reckon are still running? I'd venture to guess not very many, most value-engineered laptops like Dell, etc... tend to crap themselves at about 4-5 years, if not earlier. For those few remaining stragglers, there's older versions of distros, which will probably run better anyways, since Pentium M doesn't have the GPU or CPU grunt to run any fancy new stuff anyways, it barely runs the old stuff.
          Here at me is a HP laptop with Pentium M from 2005 which still runs fine with Mint 11 based on Ubuntu 11.04. Graphics (Intel 915GM) is working fine with open-source drivers. Compiz runs on it without any problem. I know someone who still has 2 ThinkPad T41's which may even be older. They are still working fine. I have never seen a dead Pentium M laptop.

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          • #45
            Originally posted by AlbertP View Post
            Here at me is a HP laptop with Pentium M from 2005 which still runs fine with Mint 11 based on Ubuntu 11.04. Graphics (Intel 915GM) is working fine with open-source drivers. Compiz runs on it without any problem. I know someone who still has 2 ThinkPad T41's which may even be older. They are still working fine. I have never seen a dead Pentium M laptop.
            I've never seen a dead VAX 8600, but I'm sure they exist. His point about cheap hardware crapping out sooner than it should is not countered by your experience with different manufacturers.

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            • #46
              Originally posted by yogi_berra View Post
              I've never seen a dead VAX 8600, but I'm sure they exist. His point about cheap hardware crapping out sooner than it should is not countered by your experience with different manufacturers.
              But different manufacturers used Pentium Ms. One company was cited and countered with another. The point is that Banias cores are still in existence and in use. I personally was using until late last year a Thinkpad R50 with a Banias core for my job.

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              • #47
                Originally posted by sbergman27 View Post
                Originally posted by chithanh View Post
                Sorry to break the news to you, Ubuntu has no security support for most of its packages.
                You're trolling. Canonical provides full security support for 18 months on regular releases.
                [...]
                You can optionally install packages from Universe and Multiverse. And they may or may not get security updates.
                Last I checked, the universe repository was enabled by default in the sources.list. So IMO universe counts towards the Ubuntu packages. And it contains close to 3 times as many packages as main. Then there is restricted with its software manager which nags you to install proprietary software. Both universe and restricted come without any clear commitment to security updates.

                Originally posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
                This is not true. Gentoo still supports i486 processors and I imagine that doing a Gentoo installation on a i386 system is possible (although not supported).
                glibc stopped supporting i386 around 2.4 so it is not possible to install a "normal" Gentoo system on a 386 any more. uclibc will probably be possible, but has other drawbacks.

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                • #48
                  Pentium M's are said to be old and slow in this topic but actually they can compete very well with today's lower end Atom models.

                  They are absolutely not too slow for modern Ubuntu versions and many people are still using them. There are a lot of Pentium M laptops which came with 1GB of RAM.

                  I think it's the best to use a bootloader that automatically detects the presence of PAE.

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                  • #49
                    Originally posted by AlbertP View Post
                    Pentium M's are said to be old and slow in this topic but actually they can compete very well with today's lower end Atom models.

                    They are absolutely not too slow for modern Ubuntu versions and many people are still using them. There are a lot of Pentium M laptops which came with 1GB of RAM.

                    I think it's the best to use a bootloader that automatically detects the presence of PAE.
                    I somewhat agree that they are still reasonably viable, but they are absolutely the bare minimum you can run an OS with, but the graphics are still not that great. AFAIK, they're actually still faster than Atom(except maybe the fastest dual-core), Atom is pretty slow. A $280 Brazos laptop absolutely slaughters a Pentium M.

                    The Pentium M era was right at the peak of when Dell, HP, and most others were building their absolute worst quality PCs. I'd be willing to wager that at least 85% of Pentium Ms have been recycled by now, and the rest are hand-me-down PCs that are probably on their 5th owner.

                    This is an excellent segway into the Bulldozer-bashing that's running rampant. Bulldozer is somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 times faster than Pentium M, unless you pull out the most wretchedly single-threaded benchmark you can find, then it's only perhaps 4x faster. I'm hearing from everybody now that Pentium M is good enough for people with basic needs. Does that make Bulldozer fast, or is it still slow?

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                    • #50
                      Exactly, Pentium M stuff was pretty craptacular, my old PM Banaias 1.5Ghz w/ GMA900 and 512Mb of ram is quite allot slower then my much older P4 Northwood 1.8Ghz w/ i845GL chipset that can only use the VESA driver, the only thing it has better is Gb of ram yet for day to day tasks that both are capable of the P4 seems much more responsive even without a working GPU driver.

                      And yes, this is from the guy that runs Ubuntu on a 2002 800Mhz G4 w/ Radeon 7500 and 1Gb of PC133.

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