Fedora 40 Eyes Dropping GNOME X11 Session Support

[Brittle2]

for anyone complaining about fedora simply don't use it lol, this isn't windows, you have different choices, fedora was always about pushing new things, it's their philosophy always was, and you all are suprised that they are following it, like they always did??, and don't complain about drivers with them,if you want to use proprietary drivers complain with the manufacturer.

[MadCatX]

OK, I'm almost at ease.

Not sure what kind of graphics mode is used and whether you can change screen resolution with "nomodeset". I guess the latter is not possible/available.

So if UEFI boots you into 1024x768 mode or something, that's all you'll get. With VESA you can use up to 1600x1200.

This probably depends on the kernel GPU driver. i915 with nomodeset won't go higher that 640x480. Nevertheless, it works with KWin/Wayland just fine. It's also quite irrelevant to your original argument that KMS is somehow required, which it clearly isn't.

[emansom]

Imagine you've got a kernel update which breaks your GPU driver, so you need to boot with nomodeset. No graphical session for you then while Xorg will work happily.

Won't happen. ABI compatibility guarantees.

[pracedru]

Looking forward to F40..
For now i am happy with F38 and i'm sure that F39 will be great also when it releases soon.

[C8292]

Let's go! Can't wait for it!

F40 starts to be more and more exciting and a reference as a modern distro!

[murraytony]

Imagine you've got a kernel update which breaks your GPU driver, so you need to boot with nomodeset. No graphical session for you then while Xorg will work happily.

Imagine you just downgrade your kernel and move on with your life instead of coming up with straw man arguments.

Oh, I can do that too. Imagine a kernel upgrade has a bug and doesn't boot. Neither X11 nor Wayland will work. Oh noes.

[andresdju]

Wayland requires KMS.

Imagine you've got a kernel update which breaks your GPU driver, so you need to boot with nomodeset. No graphical session for you then while Xorg will work happily.

If a kernel update breaks my ethernet driver I don't expect the community maintaining a user space implementation in case the kernel's driver breaks. KMS doesn't involve any GPU, if the kernel isn't able to configure the display driver, I think that it's the kernel were it should be fixed.

Second, Wayland Gnome session supports wayland programs and X programs (with XWayland). Launching an X11 Gnome session will not support any wayland-only program, so you are asking for the whole Gnome Desktop and all the applications you need maintaining X11 support (just in case your kms kernel driver breaks).

Third, it would be easier to have a simpler drm driver that just supports your display driver without any GPU acceleration and use llvmpipe (in case you don't have a GPU or it is not supported).

Four, if you just need running X11 apps and your kms driver breaks, you can boot any X11 window manager or desktop. If you are very cautious you can have your xserver and a simple wm installed in case the kms driver breaks.

That also means that in the future when you try to use an old Linux distro, it again won't boot into graphics mode because it doesn't yet support your new HW.

Why would your old ditribution's xserver know how to do modesetting for your new HW and the kernel don't? In any case the software needs to know how to configure the display driver and create the buffers. Am I wrong? Does Wayland need a kernel that supports the GPU to run?

And Fedora has already removed the vesa driver for Xorg. These people seemingly don't think about compability and reliability at all.

Having HW specific xserver was a bad idea from the very beginning, BIOS dependent xserver is even worse. The vesa driver doesn't give you any acceleration, it does moddesetting, let the kernel do it. For X11 the goal should be to run xserver-modesetting. Who has used the vesa driver in the last 20 years? I would not be surprised if it is very buggy, in the extreme case without kms support I would try to run fbdev instead of vesa (if you don't have at least fbdev for console support...)

[MrCooper]

Everybody needs to stop feeding the birdie.

[andresdju]

Everybody needs to stop feeding the birdie.

Let avis socialize, it has been respectful.

[cassiofb-dev]

My honesty reaction reading this and all comments 😅

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