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Fedora 40 Looks To Offer KDE Plasma 6 Desktop, Drop The KDE X11 Session

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  • #51
    Originally posted by mxan View Post
    you can say goodbye to XOrg being maintained at all.
    You think RHEL will no longer maintain xwayland?
    That's hilarious. Without xwayland even less people will choose wayland compositors than now.


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    • #52
      Originally posted by mSparks View Post

      You think RHEL will no longer maintain xwayland?
      That's hilarious. Without xwayland even less people will choose wayland compositors than now.

      Red Hat doesn't even need to maintain Xwayland.

      XWayland is managed and maintained by Wayland and its developers.

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      • #53
        Originally posted by sindex View Post

        It was poorly received because most things were expected to just work as it was an OS for the masses. It did have bugs which is no surprise as many critical subsystems were overhauled but even then most were caused by old drivers and many complaints were due to weak hardware. It was still a LOT better than the shitshow that has been the Wayland transition.
        Yeah, the transition from XDM to WDDM literally took only up till Vista SP1.

        Come Vista SP1 most hardware vendors have managed to get their shit together and deliver proper drivers. Just slightly around 13 months of initial pain. And by the time SP2 was released those issues were nothing more than distant memories.

        Vista actually had a lot of things I liked that never made it to Windows 7. So much that I skipped 7 as much as possible and went straight to 8 / 8.1.
        Last edited by Sonadow; 14 September 2023, 09:51 PM.

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        • #54
          Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
          Yeah, the transition from XDM to WDDM literally took only up till Vista SP1.

          Come Vista SP1 most hardware vendors have managed to get their shit together and deliver proper drivers. Just slightly around 13 months of initial pain.‚Äč
          If linux enforced Wayland usage on a billion people worldwide for 13 months, I suspect all it's issues would get fixed up pretty quickly too.

          A lot of the reason the switch to wayland has been so slow is that linux doesn't enforce that kind of thing (and can't) - so when people have problems, they shrug and go back to X, and don't really care about fixing wayland.

          The other half of the equation is that there is a strong sales incentive for proprietary app/driver developers to support new versions of windows quickly, which isn't really there on linux. Nvidia wouldn't be dragging their feet for years if microsoft said that all new versions of windows would require wayland support, because that would hurt their bottom line in a way that linux simply doesn't.
          Last edited by smitty3268; 15 September 2023, 12:06 AM.

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          • #55
            Love how people are still talking about global shortcuts and screen sharing not working in (KDE Plasma) Wayland, when we have the screen sharing and global shortcut portals for native Wayland apps already, and even for apps running through XWayland KDE has both the XWaylandVideoBridge for screen sharing as well as the option to pass keystrokes (either only when modifier keys are pressed or always) to XWayland apps for global shortcuts.

            Although to be fair the XWaylandVideoBridge is currently only practically accessible by downloading a Flatpak package manually and installing it (link in this blog post: https://blog.davidedmundson.co.uk/bl...ndvideobridge/) instead of distros packaging it and/or it being available on Flathub, but in my personal testing Discord in XWayland works with it at least.
            Last edited by X_m7; 15 September 2023, 01:28 AM. Reason: Fixed link

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            • #56
              Originally posted by Sonadow View Post

              Red Hat doesn't even need to maintain Xwayland.

              XWayland is managed and maintained by Wayland and its developers.
              You just said there isnt anyone else maintaining xorg.
              (xwayland is a repackaging of xorg with some wayland bloat tacked on)
              Last edited by mSparks; 15 September 2023, 02:10 AM.

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              • #57
                Originally posted by mSparks View Post

                You just said there isnt anyone else maintaining xorg.
                (xwayland is a repackaging of xorg with some wayland bloat tacked on)
                XWayland is not the Xorg.

                And Xorg's developers have all moved to develop and maintain Wayland and XWayland is under their management.

                As far as Xorg is concerned XWayland is a completely separate implementation of Xorg independent of Xorg-server.
                Last edited by Sonadow; 15 September 2023, 05:13 AM.

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                • #58
                  Originally posted by Sonadow View Post

                  XWayland is not the Xorg.

                  And Xorg's developers have all moved to develop and maintain Wayland and XWayland is under their management.

                  As far as Xorg is concerned XWayland is a completely separate implementation of Xorg independent of Xorg-server.
                  95% of xwaylands source is copied out of xorg-server. the rest is a wayland shim.
                  That's why every time they find a CVE (the only maintenance left to do in xorg-server) testing xwayland, the update happens in xorg-server first.
                  e.g.


                  The simple fact is, wayland is nothing without the 99.9999999% of Linux GUI applications that are built on X11, and none of them will ever adopt wayland, because it's a steaming pile of shit, whose only "benefit" is you can't stream the desktop, a "benefit" very recently abandoned because it's a stupid idea.

                  But if RHEL feel like dropping that support, it's only going to be one more stupid decision in a very long list of stupid decisions they've been making since they were bought by IBM.
                  Last edited by mSparks; 15 September 2023, 06:11 AM.

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                  • #59
                    Originally posted by Vistaus View Post

                    Thank you, finally someone that agrees with me! I love KDE and it's my daily driver, but Kate is one of the very few things that's awful. The last few times I said that, I received a lot of backlash for not liking Kate, but now there's finally someone that agrees with me!
                    Yeah, it was a nightmare. So unusable and confusing.

                    Do you still use Kate anyway or do you use some other Qt-based text editor on KDE?

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                    • #60
                      Originally posted by uid313 View Post

                      Yeah, it was a nightmare. So unusable and confusing.

                      Do you still use Kate anyway or do you use some other Qt-based text editor on KDE?
                      I use Kate almost daily. The Windows version at work and on Kubuntu at home. It has a lot of settings which can be confusing but if you take the time to set it up to your liking you might find it's quite powerful. What kind of issues do you have?

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