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SUSE/openSUSE Developing "Adaptable Linux Platform" For Next-Gen SUSE Linux Enterprise

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  • #11
    Originally posted by Linuxxx View Post
    Meanwhile Canonical will continue with their usual LTS paradigm established over a decade ago and still be far more successful.

    Reason being that there is simply no enterprise/community split.
    It's easy to assume that Ubuntu's relative popularity on the (free) Linux desktop means that Canonical is very successful in the (paid) enterprise, but that isn't the case. SUSE is much larger than Canonical.

    In terms of commercial success, Canonical < SUSE < Red Hat, and the jumps between those are all large. Red Hat is enormously successful compared to even SUSE. Canonical's revenue is a drop in the bucket in comparison.

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    • #12
      Originally posted by Quackdoc View Post
      Host OS and container/VM based userland? I love VMs, but this just sounds like a hassle.

      immutable filesystems in general I find to be a nightmare to work with unless your workload fits nicely into that container.
      It's a shame, because I think most of the needed pieces exist, but there are still a lot of rough edges. I can even imagine something extreme borrowing ideas from Qubes, just really slickly done. A very lightweight host which you don't even really interact with directly. Happily plowing through your daily tasks in your "main" container / vm without even really knowing it is a separate thing. You click a link in an email, if it's an external (untrusted) domain, it opens in a browser spawned in some throwaway container / vm (maybe with a highlighted border around the window). The experience is seamless no matter what you are really interacting with under the covers.

      The hardware is getting fast enough. The software pieces are starting to fall into place. But there's a crap ton of polish that would need to happen. And since my dream is about the desktop, most companies won't care since there isn't obvious money it.

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      • #13
        Originally posted by Quackdoc View Post

        immutable filesystems in general I find to be a nightmare to work with unless your workload fits nicely into that container.
        https://containertoolbx.org/ is used in Silverblue and it should be usable in other distros as well. Makes working with containers much nicer. It doesn't solve all of the problems here but goes a long way.

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        • #14
          I don't understand ... we don't know anything yet, it's hard to say something from those few words. Containers in SUSE are already widely used. Then there are those who still haven't understood, that in the last 10 years the software has changed, it has changed in terms of releases, now much more frequent, it has changed in terms of security where today there is more attention.
          An LTS distribution as a fix release is designed, freezes all packages at some point in development, releasing only security fixes, this policy made sense 10 years ago, not today. Because ?
          Because the basic concept was "don't touch it until it works", but today with hundreds of security fixes that must be backports, this paradigm, has gone to that country, the software is touched and this often generates weird bugs that software "original" does not have. Hence the need for all enterprise distributions or not, to find a solution to these problems.
          Canonical is moving in the direction of application snaps, which are containers, all enterprise LTS distributions are looking for solutions, because now all these fixes heavily modify the distribution and are becoming unmanageable.
          Not to mention the fixes that do not arrive (see Debian's situation with browsers a while ago), whereby a lot of software that cannot be fixed remains vulnerable, which is unacceptable for enterprise distributions.

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          • #15
            Originally posted by WolfpackN64 View Post
            It sounds like an immutable desktop like Fedora Silverblue, Steam OS, etc...
            Have you read https://grahamc.com/blog/erase-your-darlings ?

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            • #16
              This article is also interesting ...https://www.privacyguides.org/linux-desktop/

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              • #17
                I'm just looking forward to Leap 15.4 and KDE 5.24, I really can't be arsed updating 15.3 to the latest Qt and KDE as something always breaks, goes wrong or dependency issues, I'm just getting too old to sort out that shit. Roll on June.

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                • #18
                  Originally posted by pWe00Iri3e7Z9lHOX2Qx View Post

                  It's easy to assume that Ubuntu's relative popularity on the (free) Linux desktop means that Canonical is very successful in the (paid) enterprise, but that isn't the case. SUSE is much larger than Canonical.

                  In terms of commercial success, Canonical < SUSE < Red Hat, and the jumps between those are all large. Red Hat is enormously successful compared to even SUSE. Canonical's revenue is a drop in the bucket in comparison.
                  Part of that is age, and target market I think.

                  Red Hat and SuSE have been around (and targeting commercial entities) for a lot longer than Canonical, and companies will rarely make a shift like that without extremely good reasons (I knew a Prof. who complained about SuSE constantly, but every time he got a new system his immediate request was "Install SuSE [latest] please").

                  Red Hat is big in the US, while SuSE is (was?) more popular in Europe.

                  Not disagreeing, though.

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                  • #19
                    Originally posted by RahulSundaram View Post

                    https://containertoolbx.org/ is used in Silverblue and it should be usable in other distros as well. Makes working with containers much nicer. It doesn't solve all of the problems here but goes a long way.
                    I think it does bring it a long way, but there is still a very long way to go

                    Originally posted by pWe00Iri3e7Z9lHOX2Qx View Post

                    It's a shame, because I think most of the needed pieces exist, but there are still a lot of rough edges. I can even imagine something extreme borrowing ideas from Qubes, just really slickly done. A very lightweight host which you don't even really interact with directly. Happily plowing through your daily tasks in your "main" container / vm without even really knowing it is a separate thing. You click a link in an email, if it's an external (untrusted) domain, it opens in a browser spawned in some throwaway container / vm (maybe with a highlighted border around the window). The experience is seamless no matter what you are really interacting with under the covers.

                    The hardware is getting fast enough. The software pieces are starting to fall into place. But there's a crap ton of polish that would need to happen. And since my dream is about the desktop, most companies won't care since there isn't obvious money it.
                    I think it could be viable if they use the chrome os vmm, it's pretty sick and actually very well suited for desktop containerization, much more so then qemu is. but using crosvm as an end user is a bit more of a challenge then qemu is right now

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                    • #20
                      Originally posted by WolfpackN64 View Post
                      It sounds like an immutable desktop like Fedora Silverblue, Steam OS, etc...
                      Suse already has its own flavor of it, it's called MicroOS

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