Debian 11.0 "Bullseye" Is Very Close To Release - Now Under A Full Freeze

[waxhead]

a week ago i tried to install debian11 ... it failed... the installer is buggy if you try to install it on as encrypted harddrive.

fedora34 instead has no problem in creating a encrypted harddrive to install the OS on.

i used debian based systems for like 18 years... i really new to fedora for like 1 year...

i have a threadripper 1920X with vega64 on a asrock mainboard. i hope Debian11 installer is fixed soon so i maybe can switch back to debian.

And what was the exact things that failed? have you tried the unofficial images that includes non-free firmware?

https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/

I suggest you try that first. Bugs are an endangered species this late in the Debian release cycle.

[Operius73]

Operius73

The thing is, there is no need to manually go through an "application menu" to find what you're looking for. You just start typing either the name of the application you know exists or type a keyword associated with the type of application you're looking for. And automagically it just appears among the search results while you're typing. I know that Gnome receives a lot of hate for some unknown reason and sure, it's far from perfect, but this particular feature I find superior to other more traditional desktops.

I do not hate gnome, I have used it for a year I think. I still like the looks of it, but what you say about typing to find a program is somthing that works very well on kde/plasma too. My point is that the option to 'organize' your apps in gnome is often praised as if it's something wonderfull. Like you said, you do not really need a menu if you know what your looking for, and if you like things organized use a menu. And that is not something only gnome can do, kde/plasma has the best search/launch system I have ever used. Like I said, I do not hate gnome, it's just not for me.

[stormcrow]

I really don't get all the fuss about gnome 40. The workspaces moved from the right to the top, and the taskbar moved from the left to the bottom. Big deal. And oh, you can organize your apps in a place you can name yourself. Like all Office apps in a office icon/whatever. So basically gnome removed the application menu that sorted programs by catagory, and now instead of having a menu in the first place you are left to make your own. They really care about the user!

I'm no Gnome 3(ish) fan, but that's probably the most user oriented idea I've heard in a while. Why? Users are going to be better suited in how they arrange and orient their application icons than an arbitrary arrangement by others. That's an inherently personal choice! It's also irrelevant with many people using win er... super key + search or keyboard shortcuts.

[reba]

I'm no Gnome 3(ish) fan, but that's probably the most user oriented idea I've heard in a while. Why? Users are going to be better suited in how they arrange and orient their application icons than an arbitrary arrangement by others. That's an inherently personal choice! It's also irrelevant with many people using win er... super key + search or keyboard shortcuts.

Having programs pre-sorted is definitely better than having them all dumped into one place and then having to sort them all manually.

Of course you can still rearrange the pre-sorted applications at any time if you wish:



But maybe I misunderstood...

[Vistaus]

Debian on desktop doesn't matter anyway. It's sever OS, isn't it? Don't get me wrong,I love Debian, I use it everyday, I made it to get food because I know Debian. It just doesn't fit desktop PC too well to be hones, so why would we bother about GNOME version in Debian? It will be old whenever you look at it.

But there are desktop-oriented distros based on Debian that don't use their own repos or only for some specifics, so they'd benefit from having a newer GNOME version available in Debian's repos.

[mangeek]

And lot of incompatibilities with extensions... I maintain two, and I'm struggling to port one of them.

I feel that, but consider that with Fedora 34+ and its derivatives (CentOS Stream 9, RHEL 9), and Ubuntu 21.10+ all being on Gnome 40+, this means that you'll have to maintain 3.x and 4.x versions of your extensions for longer. This means that one major branch of the Linux desktop family tree is 'stuck in time' on 3.x while everything else is at 4.x, forcing developers to span a wider field of considerations.

[extremesquared]

I feel that, but consider that with Fedora 34+ and its derivatives (CentOS Stream 9, RHEL 9), and Ubuntu 21.10+ all being on Gnome 40+, this means that you'll have to maintain 3.x and 4.x versions of your extensions for longer. This means that one major branch of the Linux desktop family tree is 'stuck in time' on 3.x while everything else is at 4.x, forcing developers to span a wider field of considerations.

That's just the nature of software. Not a bad thing. I believe a lot of ill will towards gnome3 came from all the distros that chose to ship it in a barely-working state. There were utterly broken LTS distros in the early 2010s because of this.

[rastersoft]

I feel that, but consider that with Fedora 34+ and its derivatives (CentOS Stream 9, RHEL 9), and Ubuntu 21.10+ all being on Gnome 40+, this means that you'll have to maintain 3.x and 4.x versions of your extensions for longer. This means that one major branch of the Linux desktop family tree is 'stuck in time' on 3.x while everything else is at 4.x, forcing developers to span a wider field of considerations.

Yes, I know... but the big problem is that until now I was able to keep backwards compatibility in an easy way, but the changes done in the Activities view are so big that I, simply, don't know how to port it :-(

[arQon]

I believe a lot of ill will towards gnome3 came from all the distros that chose to ship it in a barely-working state. There were utterly broken LTS distros in the early 2010s because of this.

No, 100% of the "ill will towards gnome3" came from the GNOME devs pretending that dumpster fire was SUITABLE for release in the first place when it was broken AF, and then ignoring all the bugs for years on end to chase whatever new shiny object caught their eye next.

Blaming the distros (aside from RedHat) for "believing" the GNOME devs is just "unfair" at best: they'd already made the commitment to gnome3 (THAT, you CAN blame them for, if you really want to), and they were told it was ready - what do you expect them to do at that point when there are 70K+ OTHER packages that have all been wrestled into a releasable state, over a period of what is generally ~6 months and can be even longer than that?

"No obligation" etc notwithstanding, it's absolutely the GNOME team that shat the bed with gnome3, nobody else.

[Sonadow]

Will probably start upgrading my Threadripper 2990wx build machine to Debian 11 over the next few months while the other computers stay on Debian 10 for a while longer.

Having to do a complete refresh and rebuild of the custom 100+ libraries and applications from source code is a fucking PITA. All my custom libraries are newer than the stuff bundled in Debian 10 but older than what is shipped in Debian 11, so the rebuild is practically required.