Fedora 34 Might Try To Use PipeWire By Default To Replace PulseAudio/JACK

[skeevy420]

IMO, this is a good change and needs to happen. PipeWire is a great piece of software that replaces PulseAudio and JACK in a compatible manner. I'm just not sure if it's mature enough yet to be the default.

That's why the change happens on Fedora, now, a fluid, quick release distribution. Do it somewhere where fixes and be quickly applied when found so it's ready for more static, slower releasing distributions like RHEL, SLED, Ubuntu LTS so we don't have a repeat of PulseAudio on Ubuntu 7.04...9.04...it was a long time ago and I've smoked a lot since then...but so we don't repeat that on an LTS release used by lots and lots more people than Fedora.

[-MacNuke-]

How could Pipewire replace ALSA? Wouldn't it need to access the hardware through ALSA, like Pulseaudio?

They are talking about the client side of ALSA -> the libraries to be able to actually talk to the kernel side of ALSA an play/record sounds.

[omer666]

And what does it bring for end users?

PulseAudio has been working very well for years, and even seamlessly for me on an AV receiver handling audio and passing video through.

I suppose it's not just something that will be plugged over Pulseaudio (while still using it) without added value.

Hence, I'm wondering... For musicians, audiophiles, home theatre fans, gamers, etc... On a day to day basis, what does it bring over Pulseaudio? How is it going to improve everyone's experience (genuine question) and why should we be excited about it?

Oh, and what will it do on the video front?

I don't know about the video side of things, but to me, a common solution for both desktop and pro-audio is the most interesting part of it. When producing music, you sometimes need to listen to some reference tracks for comparison purposes, or when you are just looking for a specific file in your file manager, but JACK takes entire control of the sound card. This can be worked around with a jack sink, but it's kind of boring. The whole Jack-pulse situation brings a level of complexity that macOS and Windows don't have. I does have its advantages, but having a simpler way of handling audio while retaining a certain level of customization would certainly help.

I do remember things getting nasty when pulseaudio, NetworkManager or even gstreamer first got introduced in stable distributions, but nowadays they all have come a long way and they are strengths for the Linux ecosystem. What we should avoid is integrating them too early, but at the same time it's the only solution to get user feedback.
In my opinion, making them default on Fedora 34 requires feature parity + a simple way to move back to the legacy audio server.
With pulseaudio, Fedora did things right, but Ubuntu did not.

[dylanmtaylor]

That's why the change happens on Fedora, now, a fluid, quick release distribution. Do it somewhere where fixes and be quickly applied when found so it's ready for more static, slower releasing distributions like RHEL, SLED, Ubuntu LTS so we don't have a repeat of PulseAudio on Ubuntu 7.04...9.04...it was a long time ago and I've smoked a lot since then...but so we don't repeat that on an LTS release used by lots and lots more people than Fedora.

Users of Fedora want stability too, or at least they don't want regressions

[skeevy420]

Users of Fedora want stability too, or at least they don't want regressions

That's why I keep liking all the Toggle Switch comments. It's the best of both worlds compromise.

[dylanmtaylor]

That's why I keep liking all the Toggle Switch comments. It's the best of both worlds compromise.

Yeah, I'm happy with the change as long as it's easy (and obvious how) to switch back

[Prescience500]

Am I the only one worried about Wayland and Flatpak leaking into Pipewire?

Just shove it all into SystemD. It'll be fine.

J/k

[Britoid]

I can only assume they took the time to implement low-level hardware access within PipeWire itself, so ALSA and its bugs are no longer needed. Which is a good thing really (as long as they've done a good job with it, and I have no reason to doubt that so far).

You still need ALSA, just like you needed ALSA with Pulseaudio. ALSA is the interface the kernel audio drivers provide to the userspace, which is where the audio server lives (e.g. pulseaudio, jack, pipewire).

But, the design of Pipewire means there's lower latency between your application and the ALSA interface.

[Neraxa]

They are not dropping ASLA. ASLA is the in kernel sound card API and how you talk to sound card through the kernel, and is quite useful and flexible in itself. Pipewire is a userland streaming server. Pipewire dumps the audio data to ALSA when it needs to be played. Some apps talk to ALSA directly, so pipewire supports the ALSA API and trick the apps to talking to pipewire, then pipewire talks to the real ALSA.

[Vistaus]

Just shove it all into SystemD. It'll be fine.

J/k

PipeD? WireD?