Fedora Looking To Offer Better Upstream Solution For Hiding/Showing GRUB Menu

[Ipkh]

Screw Winows and there hidden boot options.
Never hide/remove the boot menu!
Booting fails for many reasons and not all of those reasons register in the system. Both on zwindows and Linux have failed to boot for various reasons and the system dis not register the failure and offer recovery options.
Especially for Storage issues where it can't write the log. Or random hardware issues that make the booted system unusable.
Never hide the boot menu!

Also, Screw Bios/Uefi Fastboot.

[JustinTurdeau]

Never hide/remove the boot menu!
Booting fails for many reasons ...

The mechanism for recording a successful boot is already described in the Fedora change proposal. If the boot isn't successful, it falls back to some other behaviour to allow you to debug and fix it.

Both on zwindows and Linux have failed to boot for various reasons and the system dis not register the failure and offer recovery options.

The proposed upstream changes would register a successful boot rather than registering "the failure". Doing the latter would be dumb.

There's always a way to fix a broken boot if you're not a brainlet. Slowing down every boot to show a menu, just in case it's broken, is a pretty poor design and completely unnecessary.

Also, Screw Bios/Uefi Fastboot.

Most Fastboot boards allow you to do something like hold the power button for 5 seconds to access the menu.

[Ipkh]

Shaving a few seconds of the boot process by hiding the grub menu is dumb. There are cases where it is important to have it visible. Not only that but booting the system should be rare. Linux reliably updates in place and doesn't need reboots for system updates like Windows does.
Frankly? I wish they'd go back to nice summary boot screens with basic system info rather than wasteful splash screens. Hiding the messages doesn't help with troubleshooting when problems do arise.

[JustinTurdeau]

Shaving a few seconds of the boot process by hiding the grub menu is dumb. There are cases where it is important to have it visible.

Well configure it to be visible then. Adding new options doesn't force anyone to use them.

Not only that but booting the system should be rare. Linux reliably updates in place and doesn't need reboots for system updates like Windows does.

That's bullshit. You should reboot after every kernel update ^{(unless you're using live patching)}. If you don't, not only are you running a stale kernel (which may have security issues) but there are several modules that can become degraded.

[skeevy420]

That's bullshit. You should reboot after every kernel update. If you don't, not only are you running a stale kernel (which may have security issues) but there are several modules that can become degraded.

It's possible to set up some distributions to not need full reboots. Pretty soon it'll get to the point to where we run an update and a please wait splash screen appears while the kernel, desktop, etc finalize their updates.

[JustinTurdeau]

It's possible to set up some distributions to not need full reboots. Pretty soon it'll get to the point to where we run an update and a please wait splash screen appears while the kernel, desktop, etc finalize their updates.

Right, there are several live patching implementations, but it's highly unlikely he's using one of them. Read what I was replying to:

Linux reliably updates in place and doesn't need reboots for system updates like Windows does

He thinks the running kernel gets updated in memory by virtue of it being changed on disk. Imagine being that tragically clueless, whilst making bold statements as if he's some kind of expert.

[elatllat]

kexec restarts all services, and the upstream LTS kernel gets weekly patches, so linux should get rebooted weekly. Some distros do monthly, some almost never...

[JustinTurdeau]

kexec restarts all services ...

No one was talking about using kexec. He was just talking about "Linux", as if it's done by default. Let's not start moving the goalposts.

[starshipeleven]

What should they use according to you? I haven't followed the bootloader development, so I don't know the alternatives.

rEFInd on a UEFI system

[starshipeleven]

Shaving a few seconds of the boot process by hiding the grub menu is dumb. There are cases where it is important to have it visible. Not only that but booting the system should be rare. Linux reliably updates in place and doesn't need reboots for system updates like Windows does.

it does not need to reboot to install updates, but if you updated system components (kernel, systemd, glibc, core libraries) you must reboot if you want to use them.

If you updated some secondary application you can just restart the application.