Originally posted by kpedersen
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Debian Developers Take To Voting Over Init System Diversity
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Originally posted by monraafsystemD has caused me nothing but trouble in comparision to initd
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Originally posted by pal666 View Postyou first have to wait for your naive assessment of systemd's design to become true. inevitably you will fail first
Good thing that Gentoo's devs managed to fix that with elogind.
If systemd's devs were the least competent, they would have done the work of making different systemd's components available independently themselves, not let Gentoo's devs do it.
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Originally posted by ALRBP View PostWhat naive assessment ? Systemd's designed was enough bad to make a DE (GNOME) depend on an init system ! I do not think we need more.
Originally posted by ALRBP View PostGood thing that Gentoo's devs managed to fix that with elogind.
Originally posted by ALRBP View PostIf systemd's devs were the least competent, they would have done the work of making different systemd's components available independently themselves, not let Gentoo's devs do it.
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Originally posted by pal666 View Postyou can't even think properly
so *, did elogind change systemd design? no, it didn't. therefore, design of systemd is fine
systemd's devs are more competent than you can imagine. they did have apis of different systemd's components available independently, but nobody is going to work for free for * like you, so someone besides systemd's devs had to write(and maintain) alternative implementation
"so *, did elogind change systemd design? no, it didn't. therefore, design of systemd is fine"
systemd-logind depends on the init system systemd (it is not even a separated package), elogind does not. Yes, it is a major change. All-in-one software vs independent components.
"nobody is going to work for free for * like you"
Free GNU+Linux base OS. Devuan is a fork of Debian without systemd. Devuan provides a safe upgrade path from Debian, to ensure the right to Init Freedom and avoid entanglement.
An since Gentoo is one of the most advanced GNU/Linux distributions, I do not think Gentoo's users can be called "imbeciles"
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Originally posted by monraafsystemD has caused me nothing but trouble in comparision to initd. please dont hate me for it, but i have sat in office too many times waiting for a machine to finally shut down that I am just done with systemd and lennarts shennenigans.In the company I am working now there is a legacy service and its init script is using old SysvInit, but is running over systemd (CentOS 7). Because there's a lot of computation, this service takes
Systemd has adjustable timeout values. So that wait time on shutdown can in fact be adjusted. If a system is stalling on shutdown with systemd this means that systemd is detecting something that has been given a shutdown instruction and not doing it. Systemd system without some third party software being defective shutdowns faster than sysvinit by a large margin. Systemd slow to shutdown you either mask out by adjusting the timeouts on how long it waits for miss behaving software or fix the miss behaving software that is not systemd.
Originally posted by monraafNext systemD is going to be its own OS with mailsettings and whatnot. That is not how proper software is made. systemD can be nice if you just care for a fast boot or sth. but in now way has any system gotten better in performance...at least for the machines i am root on.
Originally posted by monraafdevuan works like a charm and i am sure systemD will have its fanboys like apple or M$ did ...but that will go away eventually and we can all again enoy the philosophy again. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_philosophy
Yes the go away eventually is just you wanting to put head in sand instead of facing up to the problems and learning something new.
Yes the Unix philosophy is a fools item here. Reality is sysvinit does not do one thing right on a Linux kernel. sysvinit fails the Unix philosophy test of "Make each program do one thing well." in every single part. Systemd is in fact multi applications many of those do conform to Unix philosophy of do one thing well.
devuan like it or not it default of sysvinit does not work well. Some of the problems people complain about like the stalling shutdown problem happen when you use a solution that works we because is a sign that you have other software problems that are not systemd/openrc/shepherd that need to be fixed because this can be why at times you can have major data loss.
Systemd does not do everything wrong. Some things people complain about with systemd is because systemd is doing it right and sysvinit was doing it wrong.
Sysvinit lets just brute force kill the system on shutdown without picking up that a service has not shut down properly who cares how much data this destroys lets not give the user a sign that there is anything wrong either. That is exactly what has been going on. Systemd/openrc(with cgroups)/shepherd fixes this problem at the price that when you have something broken in your system your shutdown will be longer unless you alter the default timeout values.
On system with services and applications that shutdown properly systemd and shepherd shutdown faster than sysvinit and openrc every single time.
Really lot of the arguments against systemd are like this where they are incompetence being used to ignore a detected problem just because is a problem systemd detects and attempts to handle correctly that sysvinit never handled correctly.
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Originally posted by pal666 View Postimbecile, when was last time you were required by law to add and maintain support for several obscure and broken browsers in your package?
You are taking me , as if I was your mother or father..
If you can't hold a stable conversation about something, in a civilised manner.. make a technical retreat to your cave.
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Originally posted by monraafIf your daddy would know how dumb you are he would sell you for a petmonkey.
Originally posted by monraafroll back to the original sysVinit
sysvinit is a collection of System V-style init programs originally written by Miquel van Smoorenburg. They include init, which is run by the kernel as process 1, and is the parent of all other processes.
Anyone who is thinking about upvoting monraaf post I recommend going back and looking at how foolish of a arguement he has had.
Deleting your posts don't cover your foolishness.
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