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Debian 10.0 "Buster" Now Available - Powered By Linux 4.19, GNOME + Wayland

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  • waxhead
    replied
    Originally posted by DoMiNeLa10 View Post

    I ran into the fstab issue like 2 years ago, and I was talking about stable kernels. If you get a brand new box at work, you don't have much choice what NIC you'll have in it.

    Also, there's literally no reason for apt to not permit shorter parameters like NPM does, and there should be some update and upgrade verb built into it. Typing out entire words in a shell for something that can be abreviated is just wasting people's time, that sort of verbosity amounts to nothing, no matter how fast you can type.

    I needed newer versions of GNU software like GIMP and Emacs (as well as the newest release of Chromium to take advantage of newest dev tools), and all of those require PPAs unless you're fine with ancient "stable" versions of these.

    Debian is simply one of the worst distros out there, especially when you consider their questionable definition of free software that gets in the way, and considers GNU FDL with non-editable sections non-free, and puts it in the same repo as proprietary software.
    Well about two years ago Debian did support UUID in fstab so well, and if you get a box at work then either you either have no influence over what box you get (which is a bit strange) or your IT department does not deliver hardware that fits your use case.

    if writing apt update && apt upgrade is too time consuming and really waste your time that much (do you spend all your time installing and removing software?) then I suggest you spend a few seconds on writing an alias for your most used commands.... alias x='apt update' , alias y='apt upgrade' , alias z='apt install' etc...

    Well GIMP, Emacs and Chromium are only three packages. For GIMP Debian testing is usually following the latest release quite well - or Emacs and Chromium I have no idea since I don't use it.

    I would hardly call Debian one of the worst distros out there, it is one of the (if not the) biggest distro and it is also the mother distro for tons of others "twistros" which essentially are Debian with minor modifications. I find that Debian tries very hard to separate non-free and contributed software and while not everything may be perfect in that respect they are at least trying. For every stable release I need the non-free and contrib repos less and less which really is a good thing!

    PS! Merry Christmas and enjoy your favorite distro

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Originally posted by waxhead View Post

    1. Every package requires a PPA? that is simply incorrect. Besides I don't even thing PPA's are officially supported on Debian.
    2. Why 4.19 when 5.2 is there? because 4.19 is a LTS release and gets stability fixes for a long time. What where YOU thinking?!
    3. Debian has been uses UUID's for persistent block device naming in fstab for many years already - when did you try it last time?
    4. Use aptitude for browsing packages, it is a clean and efficient way to look for and install packages....
    5. Learn to type faster - if you use your keyboard instead of your mouse all the time you will improve
    6. Hardware compatibility is not a joke, Debian probably gave your hits on how to install your NIC drivers. And checking what hardware you get to ensure compatibility out of the box is a small price to pay for a totally free system!
    7. If you are happy with Arch then go on and use it and recommend it as well , but please do not spread incorrect information.
    I ran into the fstab issue like 2 years ago, and I was talking about stable kernels. If you get a brand new box at work, you don't have much choice what NIC you'll have in it.

    Also, there's literally no reason for apt to not permit shorter parameters like NPM does, and there should be some update and upgrade verb built into it. Typing out entire words in a shell for something that can be abreviated is just wasting people's time, that sort of verbosity amounts to nothing, no matter how fast you can type.

    I needed newer versions of GNU software like GIMP and Emacs (as well as the newest release of Chromium to take advantage of newest dev tools), and all of those require PPAs unless you're fine with ancient "stable" versions of these.

    Debian is simply one of the worst distros out there, especially when you consider their questionable definition of free software that gets in the way, and considers GNU FDL with non-editable sections non-free, and puts it in the same repo as proprietary software.

    Leave a comment:


  • waxhead
    replied
    Originally posted by DoMiNeLa10 View Post

    Even installing Debian requires luck, as their installer is the most fragile piece of crap I've ever seen. Pretty much every package requires a PPA, even if you want the newest version of GNU software. The kernel is hopelessly outdated (a new release with 4.19 when 5.2 is about to come out? what were they thinking). When it comes to new software that isn't established yet, you're more likely to find it on AUR than as a Debian PPA. I remember wasting like 20 minutes to hunt down dependencies needed to build barrier on Ubuntu once, and it wasn't fun. I enjoy that time when netinstall made a broken install, because it wrote a fstab based on block device names, which results in a unbootable system when the install medium gets enumerated as the first block device. Installation is nonexistent, the web interface for browsing packages is unbearable, and apt is overly verbose with it's invocation. I like to be able to bring my system up to date and install new software with a single command, rather than having to chain together 3 commands, with the bottleneck being me typing them in.

    Hardware compatibility with Debian is a joke, last June I couldn't install it on a Coffee Lake box because it wasn't able to recognize the NIC it had built in, and wouldn't let me through. This is what you get when you use ancient software. A "stable" distro for "getting work done" wouldn't install on my work machine. It's not up to distro maintainers to enforce misery onto users, project maintainers themselves should decide what's stable and what isn't. If something gets a new release, I expect to run it the same day, because it's been declared stable. Arch is a stable distro, there's a testing phase for every package, and stable releases are actually stable. I haven't had issues with it since I started using it as my daily drier in 2015.
    1. Every package requires a PPA? that is simply incorrect. Besides I don't even thing PPA's are officially supported on Debian.
    2. Why 4.19 when 5.2 is there? because 4.19 is a LTS release and gets stability fixes for a long time. What where YOU thinking?!
    3. Debian has been uses UUID's for persistent block device naming in fstab for many years already - when did you try it last time?
    4. Use aptitude for browsing packages, it is a clean and efficient way to look for and install packages....
    5. Learn to type faster - if you use your keyboard instead of your mouse all the time you will improve
    6. Hardware compatibility is not a joke, Debian probably gave your hits on how to install your NIC drivers. And checking what hardware you get to ensure compatibility out of the box is a small price to pay for a totally free system!
    7. If you are happy with Arch then go on and use it and recommend it as well , but please do not spread incorrect information.

    Leave a comment:


  • greyseek3r
    replied
    I believe most of bad experiences with Debian originates from lack of nonfree firmware files (firmware-linux-nonfree package) in isos. They really should include a nonfree iso and give people a choice. Free Software is great, but we should be able to boot the iso in order to use it. When you install it, Debian is really good. And if you want somewhat recent software with Debian Stable, just enable the backports repository.

    Leave a comment:


  • increasechief
    replied
    Isn't this just Linux From Scratch?

    Leave a comment:


  • andyprough
    replied
    Originally posted by Sonadow View Post

    Build your own. It's not that difficult. My kernel, libdrm, libglvnd and Mesa are all built from the latest upstream.

    In addition to that, I compiled my own entire seperate runtime environment in $HOME/Runtime that contains the following:
    • llvm-9 with clang, libc++, libc++abi, openMP and lld
    • libpng from git
    • libjpeg from upstream
    • libogg, libtheora, libvorbis, libflac from Xiph
    • x264, x265, vp8 and vp9
    • openssl
    • Python 3.8 beta
    • libnss + nspr
    • Rust
    • SDL2
    • and many other stuff needed to run most applications
    Then in $HOME/Runtime/Applications, I compiled all the applications I need, linking against $HOME/Runtime. Perfect seperation between system and user.

    And because I just upgraded my notebook with a new SSD and installed Debian 10 in it as well, I can just copy $HOME/Runtime from my desktop over to $NewLaptop and start using all my applications immediately again.
    You should seriously write a step-by-step and get Michael to post it on Phoronix. That's definitely worth duplicating.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sonadow
    replied
    Originally posted by skeevy420 View Post

    The results I got when searching for Debian Buster packages with their website package searching tool the other night.
    Build your own. It's not that difficult. My kernel, libdrm, libglvnd and Mesa are all built from the latest upstream.

    In addition to that, I compiled my own entire seperate runtime environment in $HOME/Runtime that contains the following:
    • llvm-9 with clang, libc++, libc++abi, openMP and lld
    • libpng from git
    • libjpeg from upstream
    • libogg, libtheora, libvorbis, libflac from Xiph
    • x264, x265, vp8 and vp9
    • openssl
    • Python 3.8 beta
    • libnss + nspr
    • Rust
    • SDL2
    • and many other stuff needed to run most applications
    Then in $HOME/Runtime/Applications, I compiled all the applications I need, linking against $HOME/Runtime. Perfect seperation between system and user.

    And because I just upgraded my notebook with a new SSD and installed Debian 10 in it as well, I can just copy $HOME/Runtime from my desktop over to $NewLaptop and start using all my applications immediately again.
    Last edited by Sonadow; 08 July 2019, 12:24 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • skeevy420
    replied
    Originally posted by Sonadow View Post

    I have LLVM 9 and Mesa 19.1 on my installation of Buster. What's your problem?
    The results I got when searching for Debian Buster packages with their website package searching tool the other night.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sonadow
    replied
    Originally posted by skeevy420 View Post

    When you need things like LLVM 9 for AMDGPU optimizations, or, holy shit, Mesa newer than 18.3...ROFL...Debian is going to suck for gaming.
    I have LLVM 9 and Mesa 19.1 on my installation of Buster. What's your problem?

    Leave a comment:


  • Sonadow
    replied
    Originally posted by imout0 View Post
    buuusteeeerrrrr!!!!

    Beammmmmmm!!!
    are you okaayy? Buuusstaaahhhhh.....wolf!!

    Leave a comment:

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