OpenSUSE Rolls Out Tumbleweed Snapshots

[phoronix]

Phoronix: OpenSUSE Rolls Out Tumbleweed Snapshots

For those that may enjoy the rolling-release nature of openSUSE Tumbleweed but want to be a bit more conservative with the updates, Tumbleweed now supports the concept of snapshots...

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=openSUSE-Tumbleweed-Snaps

[andyprough]

Tumbleweed has always had snapshots. What this does is point Tumbleweed's software update to a mirrored repository which does not change - so the repository itself is "snapshotted" and unchanging. This allows you to add new packages from the same snapshot repository without having to update the entire system.

When the user is ready to update the entire system, they will use the command "tumbleweed switch", which will redirect Tumbleweed to the latest update repository, refresh, and run a system update.

I don't think I will use this myself, at least until it matures for awhile. I sometimes lock a package from updating with the "zypper addlock" command, especially when Firefox and LibreOffice have received unstable changes that I was trying to avoid. But I haven't had the need to lock the entire system from updating.

[Sonadow]

First up, this is not even official. The guy just got sick of waiting over a year for the initiative to get official recognition and hosting from OpenSUSE that he decided to host it on AWS out of his own pocket. There is no way this can be cheap; package repositories are huge and AWS S3 isn't exactly the most affordable hosting option IIRC.

Tumbleweed has always had snapshots. What this does is point Tumbleweed's software update to a mirrored repository which does not change - so the repository itself is "snapshotted" and unchanging. This allows you to add new packages from the same snapshot repository without having to update the entire system.

When the user is ready to update the entire system, they will use the command "tumbleweed switch", which will redirect Tumbleweed to the latest update repository, refresh, and run a system update.

I don't think I will use this myself, at least until it matures for awhile. I sometimes lock a package from updating with the "zypper addlock" command, especially when Firefox and LibreOffice have received unstable changes that I was trying to avoid. But I haven't had the need to lock the entire system from updating.

I'm not familiar with how Tumbleweed's concept of snapshots work. Mind explaining how it is done and what the user needs to do? For example, if today package X gets updated to two days later, package Y gets updated, each of those updates is its own snapshot? And how does zypper know to choose between each 'snapshot'?

I'm thinking of trying out a rolling distribution within the next year or so and Tumbleweed is one of the candidates in mind. But I want to be able to lock most of the system (X, Wayland, GTK, Qt, Gnome, KDE, all libraries and devel headers) like how a discreet release distribution work.

[KRiloshart]

Opensuse always innovates on desktop linux side, but unfortunately gets lot less attention than they deserve.

[andyprough]

I'm not familiar with how Tumbleweed's concept of snapshots work. Mind explaining how it is done and what the user needs to do? For example, if today package X gets updated to two days later, package Y gets updated, each of those updates is its own snapshot? And how does zypper know to choose between each 'snapshot'?

I'm thinking of trying out a rolling distribution within the next year or so and Tumbleweed is one of the candidates in mind. But I want to be able to lock most of the system (X, Wayland, GTK, Qt, Gnome, KDE, all libraries and devel headers) like how a discreet release distribution work.

Tumbleweed creates a new snapshot every few days. A snapshot is simply the starting point for a new installation. Once every few days, a new snapshot of the whole huge collection of software is placed on the Tumbleweed download page as a 4GB DVD image. For example, the snapshot available today is 20171125 - or the collection of software from November 25th. Be sure and read the notes on this page before installing, as there is a specific command you must use when getting updates. Also, keep in mind that you'll need to reboot after updating essential libraries, or you can bork the system. Multimedia codecs and Nvidia drivers can be installed with 1-click installation from here.

Once you've installed with the snapshot, zypper does not "choose between" snapshots to give you software. zypper pulls your updates from "factory" after the collection of constantly updated software has been tested to run with Tumbleweed.

You can definitely lock any part of the system you like. If you want to lock a couple of packages, do it from the command line with the "zypper addlock" command. If you are going to lock a large number of packages, it's easier to do it from within the YAST graphical software manager, which works in a similar manner to synaptic.

[Sonadow]

Tumbleweed creates a new snapshot every few days. A snapshot is simply the starting point for a new installation. Once every few days, a new snapshot of the whole huge collection of software is placed on the Tumbleweed download page as a 4GB DVD image. For example, the snapshot available today is 20171125 - or the collection of software from November 25th. Be sure and read the notes on this page before installing, as there is a specific command you must use when getting updates. Also, keep in mind that you'll need to reboot after updating essential libraries, or you can bork the system. Multimedia codecs and Nvidia drivers can be installed with 1-click installation from here.

Once you've installed with the snapshot, zypper does not "choose between" snapshots to give you software. zypper pulls your updates from "factory" after the collection of constantly updated software has been tested to run with Tumbleweed.

You can definitely lock any part of the system you like. If you want to lock a couple of packages, do it from the command line with the "zypper addlock" command. If you are going to lock a large number of packages, it's easier to do it from within the YAST graphical software manager, which works in a similar manner to synaptic.

Not quite sure if I understand. So let's say for example, today i download the latest snapshot image, which is 20171125. This is the image i will be using to install Tumbleweed.

Then let's say that for the next 9 months, any and all software I pull from the repository must not be updated versions; they must be the versions available from snapshot 20171125. For example, in snapshot 20171125, package A to Z is at version 9, and eight months later, the latest snapshot for packages A to Z is now 20. If i run zypper -v install for packages A to Z, will I still pull v9, or will all the packages be updated to v20?

[niner]

Not quite sure if I understand. So let's say for example, today i download the latest snapshot image, which is 20171125. This is the image i will be using to install Tumbleweed.

Then let's say that for the next 9 months, any and all software I pull from the repository must not be updated versions

You say you want to try a rolling distribution but want it to be a regular distribution. That's not going to work. If you want a regular distribution with locked versions, try openSUSE Leap. It's an excellent compromise between stable and up-to-date. If you really want to use a rolling distribution, then use it exactly like that. OpenSUSE Tumbleweed makes it rather painless anyway. They automatically test the full distribution for every (daily) snapshot, so they can be reasonably sure that updates don't break badly. OpenSUSE also uses btrfs as root file system and has snapper deeply integrated, so in the very rare case that an update goes wrong, you can simply roll back to your previous system (without losing data).

[starshipeleven]

Not quite sure if I understand. So let's say for example, today i download the latest snapshot image, which is 20171125. This is the image i will be using to install Tumbleweed.

Then let's say that for the next 9 months, any and all software I pull from the repository must not be updated versions; they must be the versions available from snapshot 20171125. For example, in snapshot 20171125, package A to Z is at version 9, and eight months later, the latest snapshot for packages A to Z is now 20. If i run zypper -v install for packages A to Z, will I still pull v9, or will all the packages be updated to v20?

It will only pull from v9. Did you read the announcement? it explains things https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-.../msg00591.html

It's not supposed to be used to stay frozen for 9 months, but to run a single snapshot update every week/month or so instead of downloading piecemeal 100 MB every few days, or being forced to pull down 200 MB of updates to be able to install a 10 MB application (as in newer snapshots it was rebuilt with newer versions of libraries you have installed and everything must be updated if you want to use it).

I quite frankly don't see the point, but I'm not against this either.

[boombatower]

Not quite sure if I understand. So let's say for example, today i download the latest snapshot image, which is 20171125. This is the image i will be using to install Tumbleweed.

Then let's say that for the next 9 months, any and all software I pull from the repository must not be updated versions; they must be the versions available from snapshot 20171125. For example, in snapshot 20171125, package A to Z is at version 9, and eight months later, the latest snapshot for packages A to Z is now 20. If i run zypper -v install for packages A to Z, will I still pull v9, or will all the packages be updated to v20?

eight months later you would still pull v9. If you choose to point your repositories to the latest snapshot you will pull v20. This mirrors the workflow used with fixed release distros where the base system is not constantly rebased.

[boombatower]

It will only pull from v9. Did you read the announcement? it explains things https://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-.../msg00591.html

It's not supposed to be used to stay frozen for 9 months, but to run a single snapshot update every week/month or so instead of downloading piecemeal 100 MB every few days, or being forced to pull down 200 MB of updates to be able to install a 10 MB application (as in newer snapshots it was rebuilt with newer versions of libraries you have installed and everything must be updated if you want to use it).

I quite frankly don't see the point, but I'm not against this either.

Yes, the idea is not to sit for 9 months, but rather at most 2-3 months and likely for many a week or two. It just avoid needing to update before installing anything new as just installing a new package when the remote repository has seen large changes can result in an unusable machine. This allows the user to choose when to update vs just install a new package for my current snapshot. That way Tumbleweed can be used like a "mini-fixed distro" rather than crossing your fingers or updating nearly everyday.