GNOME 3.26: Wayland vs. X.Org Performance - Boot Times, Power Use, Memory Use & Gaming

[valeriodean]

There are lots of blog post, articles,comparison and x.org conference talk that explain why wayland is better than X from developers of the linux graphical stack (not the random people of the street). Use google.

Honestly, a display server that shows half pixel from the fame A and half from the frame B not because a bug but because its design then is broken by design.
I can easly reproduce it right now, scrolling a web browser page.

[Tomin]

You can talk X11 dead, but I don't see anyone listening. I expect it to be around for a little longer. Wayland first has to work as well as X11 before one can begin to talk about advantages. Just having hopes alone will not do.

Sure you can talk about advantages of things even if they have disadvantages.

And Wayland is very much functional with multiple functional implementations, i.e. it is working.

[stupotace]

The gain will then only exist for the developers, and only after it outweights the extra cost for it's development. By that time can one also have made improvements to X11. That's why I'm saying that I'm not convinced.

This is the major point that you are glossing over though. Developers are what make the open source world go round. They want to develop on Wayland. They want to advance Wayland forward. You can and should stick on X11 for as long as you want. Eventually, you'll want to switch to Wayland because of something Wayland offers that X11 doesn't. And you'll probably be angry that development for it wasn't done in X11. But you don't get to decide what developers are passionate about and where they spend their efforts. A better code base and/or api can do a lot for making forward progress with development.

It's the difference between a house that has had 4 separate additions built onto it vs a new large building with a better/larger foundation from the start. Sure, the existing house is already furnished and it's functional, but making any sort of further changes gets harder and harder. Eventually you won't be able to make any major structural changes, you can pretty much only fill in cracks and paint it. But it's there, it works. It doesn't have any giant holes in the roof. But you can't be upset that people want to put effort on a whole new building that's laid out differently.

[geearf]

I've heard time and time again that the network-transparency of Xorg in modern situations is a myth or not very usable with very few applications still using Xorg draw commands.

I quick search returned, for example:


source=https://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2011/08/thoughts-about-network-trancparency/

X11 is a dead end, it has multiple problems that can not be fixed while keeping X11 compatibility. It will still be around for a long time, but it doesn't have a real future outside of running legacy applications.

I haven't done that in years, but NX was way better than native X11 networking, even on my then not so fast home connection.

[Azrael5]

the results of wayland are good. When the transition ends the improvements will be clear to all ones.It's useless test x11 applications with wayland because they uses xwayland which is x11.

[sdack]

And Wayland is very much functional with multiple functional implementations, i.e. it is working.

You cannot use this as an argument when it's the very least you'd expect from any software, that it's working.

I expected it to show some promising performance numbers at it's current stage. This isn't the case however. Even systemd in it's early stage at least showed very promising performance. Now all I can hope for is that it doesn't get worse the longer the development takes and the more features are getting added to it, which is what usually happens.

The analogy with a CDROM vs. Floppy is what I would wish for in my wildest dreams, but it's not really the case here, is it? CDROMs are faster than floppies, offer much more capacity than floppies and make prettier coasters, too. If Wayland would only be this good.

[Tomin]

You cannot use this as an argument when it's the very least you'd expect from any software, that it's working.

That was just a counter argument to me misreading that you had said that Wayland is not working. But that was not the case, my bad. (You actually said "working as well as".) I'm a little tired (almost midnight here). Still, doesn't make it less true that there can be both advantages and disadvantages.

[RussianNeuroMancer]

While all cool kids still on the block - what is open source alternative to Citrix XenApp and VMware Horizon App? Ulteo Open Virtual Desktop is only thing I can remember, and unfortunately it's based on X.Org Server. Is there a way to implement this with Wayland in mind?

[Brisse]

I expected it to show some promising performance numbers at it's current stage.

You keep mentioning performance, but that's just not what Wayland is about. My impression is that it's about security and ease of development and maintenance. As far as I understand, there are no performance issues with X, and thus, there is not much room for improvment in that area. That doesn't invalidate Waylands existence. In fact, I think if Wayland is a success, the end user won't notice a single thing when moving from X to Wayland. There are benefits, but it's not immediately noticable for the end user.

[sdack]

While all cool kids still on the block - what is open source alternative to Citrix XenApp and VMware Horizon App? Ulteo Open Virtual Desktop is only thing I can remember, and unfortunately it's based on X.Org Server. Is there a way to implement this with Wayland in mind?

I just ran across this article. VNC is said to be making a comeback under Wayland.

https://ctrl.blog/entry/wayland-gnome-remote-desktop