KDE Plasma 5.5 On Wayland May Be Ready For Early Adopters

[valeriodean]

Slightly OT but how des pulseaudio work with wayland? What happens to the PULSE_SERVER attribute stored in the X11 root window?

What do you mean?
Pulseaudio is the audio server, Wayland is the protocol to build a display server, so the question makes little sense to me. If the UI of the program that you are used to launch to set the audio in your DE is ported on Wayland, then I guess it will continue to manage your audio through pulseaudio good as well as for the X version, isn't it?

I love the work the KDE devs are doing, however I'm fine if someone disagree. For those people I have an hint: change the DE. Nobody force you to use KDE to run linux on your pc, it's not windows, so don't stay on a DE that don't fit your need. It's so easy.

[Kemosabe]

What do you mean?
Pulseaudio is the audio server, Wayland is the protocol to build a display server, so the question makes little sense to me. If the UI of the program that you are used to launch to set the audio in your DE is ported on Wayland, then I guess it will continue to manage your audio through pulseaudio good as well as for the X version, isn't it?

I love the work the KDE devs are doing, however I'm fine if someone disagree. For those people I have an hint: change the DE. Nobody force you to use KDE to run linux on your pc, it's not windows, so don't stay on a DE that don't fit your need. It's so easy.

Well, as i said PULSE_SERVER is stored in the X11 root window. All your pulseaudio apps do use it. You never set any global PULSE_AUDIO environment variable anywhere. The very obvious question is now: How is this handled in wayland since there is no X11 root window anymore.

Does this make more sense to you?

If not, i do a third formulation: How would you port for example pavucontrol to wayland which depends on X11 for said reasons?

[Jumbotron]

I'm going to be very very blunt here...
WHY ARE YOU HERE?

given your rather obvious distaste for geeks and geek culture, your presence makes no sense in one of the more hard core geek groups that is OSS. Furthermore the only thing you've done on this particular forum is lie, FUD, and tantrum So just what exactly are you doing here?

To make your life hell. : )

Son, I've been at it in the computing world since punch card programming Fortran on Vax Mainframes. I've paid my dues. I'm an old school DIY hacker and geek, so I've got nothing against the culture I was a part of in the 70's and 80's. However, I didn't make Phreak and Geek culture and thinking into a "totem". That is to say....I'd always try to keep the common man thinking close to heart when it came to either explaining Phreak and Geek things to the common user OR when it came to helping them use my software.

The problem with you Phreaks and Geeks is that you LIKE Linux being marginalized to 1% market share compared to Windows and the Mac. It ENHANCES your Phreak and Geek street cred. It gives you a way to be different. But more than that it ENHANCES your eliteness. Too many of Linux Phreaks and Geeks LIKE to be considered ELITE. "OOOOooo.....we know CODE....you DON'T. "GUI's......pfft.....learn Command Line like the rest of us." "Sudo this....Bash that.....script, script, script."

The thing about technology that most of you Linux Phreaks and Geeks don't get is that it that technology DID NOT REALLY change the world at any given point in time when that new technology was introduced ( insert any historical tech here ) until that technology left the hallowed halls of the technician and was made EASILY DISTRIBUTED, EASILY UNDERSTOOD, and EASILY OPERATED AND MAINTAINED by the common man.

What most of you Linux Phreaks and Geeks don't get is that being OPEN IS NOT ENOUGH ! Being FREE IS NOT ENOUGH ! You guys can write a million lines of really brilliant code and can't even write a decent installer. Where is the Linux version of a Wizard ? We should be able to download ANY program for Linux and install it SIMPLY and CLEANLY on ANY Linux distribution. But NOOOOOooooo......we have to have the FREEDOM and the OPENNESS to package it as an RPM or DEB or a SNAPPY or EBUILD or TGZ, etc, etc.

Then.....we have the OPENNESS and the FREEDOM to pick what framework we want with a MYRIAD of widget design schemes in order to DESTROY any kind of cohesive look and feel to our programs....( GNOME....KDE.....UBUNTU.....MATE.....CINNAMON..... ENLIGHTENMENT......etc...etc...). What if I like a certain KDE program above an equivalent GNOME program. GREAT....and here is your BUTT LOAD OF KDE LIBRARIES and DEPENDENCIES along with it. And on top of that the KDE program is going to look like SHIT compared to the rest of your GNOME programs. And this goes the opposite way also for adding GNOME programs to KDE environments.

I'm not saying kill openness and freedom. Not at all...like I or anyone could anyway. But a LOT more people in the Linux world need to understand that openness and freedom can also breed confusion and complexity. AND THAT is what kills Linux's uptake with the general computing population.

So Luke.....tell me....other than attacking me like a little 15 year kid in his mother's basement hacking out code because you don't have any social skills to make it in the real world....what precisely do you do that is of any use in the world of OSS ?

[Jumbotron]

i managed to read the warnings from the KDE devs at the time and bide by them by not installing 4.0. Anyone who didn't has only themselves to blame.

Spoken like a true Linux Phreak and Geek. What about the common user who is looking to come over from Windows or the Mac ?

Do they have the knowledge to know to read KDE dev warnings or go looking at forums to know that ? How could they ? They've spent 10...20...maybe 30 years in the Windows and Mac world NEVER having to worry about that.

If KDE or GNOME or Linux in general wants to grow pass their irrelevant market share, then the Phreaks and Geeks have to be fenced in a little more to the back room writing code and let people in their organizations who actually USE COMPUTERS LIKE THE COMMON MAN market, package and deploy that software in a sane and safe manner to the common user in order to build up a feeling that Linux is NOT hard to learn and/or use.

The best example of that so far in the Linux world....( and they are not perfect ) are the guys at Linux Mint.

[Jumbotron]

if you couldn't work that out for yourself, more fool you.

Didn't fool me a bit. Just calling out KDE's bullshit policy of releasing BETA and even ALPHA software and not making it plain to the common user out their looking to move from the Windows or Mac world. And not holding distros to account that include their beta or alpha software without verbiage that makes it plain that this version of a distro is likely DANGEROUS and will almost certainly break your system if you install it on a production machine.

Or better yet....just have a private alpha and beta release.

Let Microsoft be the only ones who let their user base be the REAL beta testers. Like they did with the release of Windows Vista. That's how we got Windows 7. We got Windows 7 only after 10's of millions of Windows users unwittingly became Windows Vista beta testers for a couple of years.

That's why I consider KDE 5 as the Windows Vista of Linux.

[CrystalGamma]

Well, as i said PULSE_SERVER is stored in the X11 root window. All your pulseaudio apps do use it. You never set any global PULSE_AUDIO environment variable anywhere. The very obvious question is now: How is this handled in wayland since there is no X11 root window anymore.

Does this make more sense to you?

If not, i do a third formulation: How would you port for example pavucontrol to wayland which depends on X11 for said reasons?

I've used GNOME3 on Wayland for a while, and playing audio worked ... I don't remember using pavucontrol, but if something obvious like that was missing I think I'd have noticed.
The most annoying thing on Wayland for now is problems with Drag'n'Drop / Copy-Paste between Xwayland and Wayland windows.

[duby229]

To make your life hell. : )

Son, I've been at it in the computing world since punch card programming Fortran on Vax Mainframes. I've paid my dues. I'm an old school DIY hacker and geek, so I've got nothing against the culture I was a part of in the 70's and 80's. However, I didn't make Phreak and Geek culture and thinking into a "totem". That is to say....I'd always try to keep the common man thinking close to heart when it came to either explaining Phreak and Geek things to the common user OR when it came to helping them use my software.

The problem with you Phreaks and Geeks is that you LIKE Linux being marginalized to 1% market share compared to Windows and the Mac. It ENHANCES your Phreak and Geek street cred. It gives you a way to be different. But more than that it ENHANCES your eliteness. Too many of Linux Phreaks and Geeks LIKE to be considered ELITE. "OOOOooo.....we know CODE....you DON'T. "GUI's......pfft.....learn Command Line like the rest of us." "Sudo this....Bash that.....script, script, script."

The thing about technology that most of you Linux Phreaks and Geeks don't get is that it that technology DID NOT REALLY change the world at any given point in time when that new technology was introduced ( insert any historical tech here ) until that technology left the hallowed halls of the technician and was made EASILY DISTRIBUTED, EASILY UNDERSTOOD, and EASILY OPERATED AND MAINTAINED by the common man.

What most of you Linux Phreaks and Geeks don't get is that being OPEN IS NOT ENOUGH ! Being FREE IS NOT ENOUGH ! You guys can write a million lines of really brilliant code and can't even write a decent installer. Where is the Linux version of a Wizard ? We should be able to download ANY program for Linux and install it SIMPLY and CLEANLY on ANY Linux distribution. But NOOOOOooooo......we have to have the FREEDOM and the OPENNESS to package it as an RPM or DEB or a SNAPPY or EBUILD or TGZ, etc, etc.

Then.....we have the OPENNESS and the FREEDOM to pick what framework we want with a MYRIAD of widget design schemes in order to DESTROY any kind of cohesive look and feel to our programs....( GNOME....KDE.....UBUNTU.....MATE.....CINNAMON..... ENLIGHTENMENT......etc...etc...). What if I like a certain KDE program above an equivalent GNOME program. GREAT....and here is your BUTT LOAD OF KDE LIBRARIES and DEPENDENCIES along with it. And on top of that the KDE program is going to look like SHIT compared to the rest of your GNOME programs. And this goes the opposite way also for adding GNOME programs to KDE environments.

I'm not saying kill openness and freedom. Not at all...like I or anyone could anyway. But a LOT more people in the Linux world need to understand that openness and freedom can also breed confusion and complexity. AND THAT is what kills Linux's uptake with the general computing population.

So Luke.....tell me....other than attacking me like a little 15 year kid in his mother's basement hacking out code because you don't have any social skills to make it in the real world....what precisely do you do that is of any use in the world of OSS ?

As soon as you said linux installer, that was that. You are free to have your opinions of course, but you're wrong.

[Luke_Wolf]

As soon as you said linux installer, that was that. You are free to have your opinions of course, but you're wrong.

Yep... exactly... although based on his posts my sense is that the guy hasn't ever actually even used linux in the modern sense, if ever. That he's a windows user who watched Pirates of Silicon Valley and is now trolling around in OSS space for reasons...

[duby229]

Yep... exactly... although based on his posts my sense is that the guy hasn't ever actually even used linux in the modern sense, if ever. That he's a windows user who watched Pirates of Silicon Valley and is now trolling around in OSS space for reasons...

Well, we all know what the benefits of package management are.

New systems like snappy and what not are going to bloat the hell out of their distro's and then the rest us will finally ultimately be proven right.

[Jumbotron]

Spoken like true Phreaks and Geeks. You little boys and your command line..... like that's "modern". LOL. As I said before, I punch card programmed Vax Mainframes in the late 70's early 80's. So you can pat yourself on your little Linux Elite backs all you want and call me a Windows user all you want. Which I was....also on the Mac. Now on Linux exclusively at home and mixed OS (Windows, Mac and Linux) at work. I know my way around command line on all three.

But Linux will never become mainstream....or even CLOSE to being as mainstream as Windows or Mac because you little "NOUVEAU GEEK" script kiddies think that command line is "modern".

Well....it will, now that I think about it. It's just going to be known as Android. Particularly once Google folds more of Chrome OS into Android over the next couple of three years.

And then all you little wankers will STILL be bitching about why Linux has no support from hardware makers....why Linux STILL has no games or the number of well supported games like Windows or even the Mac.....why there are NO VIABLE Linux phones or a Linux phone app ecosystem the likes of iOS or Android.

But....hey....that keeps your little Linux Geek Elitist stature intact. You like being the outsiders.....the 1% <chuckle....see what I did there, to use an already cliched hipster phrase?)

Oh....and DOO DOO....sorry....duby.....package management or an universal Linux installer is the way of the future. Snappy is a good first start. Not that I agree with everything about Ubuntu ( which is why I use Linux Mint's version of Ubuntu since Unity is a bit of a trainwreck ). But at least they are trying to make Linux into a first rate CONSUMER Linux distro the likes of Windows or the Mac.

Once again....even if they don't....in the near future....people will only know the REAL Linux, you know....the one with a Universal Installer for apps and is easy to use with no "command line modernism <snicker> by the name of Android or Chrome OS.....or when they fuse the two. Perhaps ChromeDroid.

That's not what I HOPE......but because of you and thousands more like you with your snotty little Linux Geek "command line modernism" attitude, you will see that come to pass. And you will still be the little irrelevant 1%

And that is a damn shame for all the ones I'm trying to convince to come home to Linux.