LibreOffice 25.2 Alpha 1 Open-Source Office Suite Released

[Vistaus]

Did you seriously early bird the thread just to say you prefer closed-source spyware because "open-source is old and ugly"?

Did you really just call Markdown, LaTeX and OnlyOffice closed-source spyware?

[Lionel]

LibreOffice Calc is the anchor of LibreOffice, and they just must fix Pivot Tables and the chart functionality first, if it is ever going to be considered anything remotely as a replacement to MS Excel.

I am retired now but in In 2018 I wrote in the thread " Changes Begin Building Up For LibreOffice 6.1"
" 01 April 2018, 12:27 AM
I would like a real tool for data analysis...
Today 6.0 pivot table module in Calc is incredibly inferior to the Excel 2000 version I use at work."

[WeAreDoomed]

So, I just did a quick test on one of my documents (originally created and edited with word 2021).
Somewhat standard, but with styles, summary, headers, etc.

Libreoffice 24.8 : apparently can't use the CordiaUPC font (used only once), use a similar font instead
Summary looks a little different, some little changes here and here, nothing crazy

OnlyOffice 8.2.3 : apparently can't use the CordiaUPC font (used only once), use a very distinct font instead, very noticeable and a little weird
Also can't display pages side by side, also can't open several windows for the same file.
Summary looks a little different, nothing crazy

All in all both programs seem to be very good alternatives to word, libreoffice is noticeably better with my workflow/usage.

I also use excel documents with macro, libreoffice is better than onlyoffice in this regard (it displays some boxes for example), but it is still basically unusable (with that kind of files).

I feel like word have already good competitors, so maybe the real problem is excel.

[Daktyl198]

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Feature_Comparison:_LibreOffice_-_Microsoft_Office

Not in fact true on that 1000x thing. Its a few 100 different things that Libreoffice does not do that MS Office does. The reverse is true as well. In functionality they are a lot closer to each other than they first appear. But when you hit the miss functionality it ruins your day. Small differences can be insanely painful.

That comparison chart is so biased, it's not even funny. For example, scripting support. It tries to claim that it's superior because it supports scripting in multiple languages, but the scripting it supports is basic af because it's missing a lot of Excel features in general. On top of that, it doesn't matter what languages it supports because what it doesn't support is the scripting in Excel sheets, so it's useless. They label it as green, but it should be red. For language support, it lists MS Office as yellow despite them having far superior language tools available, just with fewer languages supported. LibreOffice keeps trying to claim feature support for things that require plugins that may or may not be updated in the future.

[oiaohm]

So, I just did a quick test on one of my documents (originally created and edited with word 2021).
Somewhat standard, but with styles, summary, headers, etc.

Libreoffice 24.8 : apparently can't use the CordiaUPC font (used only once), use a similar font instead
Summary looks a little different, some little changes here and here, nothing crazy

OnlyOffice 8.2.3 : apparently can't use the CordiaUPC font (used only once), use a very distinct font instead, very noticeable and a little weird
Also can't display pages side by side, also can't open several windows for the same file.
Summary looks a little different, nothing crazy

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/typography/font-list/cordiaupc

Do have a question here over CordiaUPC font does make sense for it to be missing if you are testing on a Linux/Mac system.

Now if you were testing on Windows this might not be different font. Mac OS users of MS Office due to it using freetype as well have had issues where a font has rendered slightly differently. Yes libreoffice and onlyoffice use free-type but different free-type configuration can effect output.

CordiaUPC font versions
Windows 10/11 5.06
Windows 8.1 5.01
Windows 8.0 to 7 5.00
Windows Server 2008 and Vista 5.00 as well.

These font version difference between Windows does cause a lot of breakages. You want to put multi generations of windows on the same font page lot of cases it buy all the fonts you use and be paying license fees.

[WeAreDoomed]

Do have a question here over CordiaUPC font does make sense for it to be missing if you are testing on a Linux/Mac system.
Now if you were testing on Windows this might not be different font. Mac OS users of MS Office due to it using freetype as well have had issues where a font has rendered slightly differently. Yes libreoffice and onlyoffice use free-type but different free-type configuration can effect output.
CordiaUPC font versions
Windows 10/11 5.06
Windows 8.1 5.01
Windows 8.0 to 7 5.00
Windows Server 2008 and Vista 5.00 as well.

These font version difference between Windows does cause a lot of breakages. You want to put multi generations of windows on the same font page lot of cases it buy all the fonts you use and be paying license fees.

Good catch, it seems the cordiaupc font was not installed on this system (win11pro, side by side comparison of the three softwares), I should have check, my bad. After install, the display is correct in libreoffice and onlyoffice.
Still, I wonder if word use embedded font? the render seemed correct, even without the font installed?

[oiaohm]

but the scripting it supports is basic af because it's missing a lot of Excel features in general. On top of that, it doesn't matter what languages it supports because what it doesn't support is the scripting in Excel sheets,

https://kychem.wordpress.com/2022/12/26/libreoffice-embedding-python-scripts-into-a-calc-file/

https://help.libreoffice.org/latest/he/text/shared/optionen/macrosecurity_sl.html

Libreoffice does support scripting in Excel sheet. Did you in fact Digitally sign your macros. Libreoffice has a higher set default security level on Macro that equals embedded macros in files not working if they are not signed because they are not trusted.

Small difference lots of pain.

Libreoffice does have sheet events to hook up macros and embedded form control into Calc again to hook up Macros.

This does require a different thought process. Embedded form controls under MS Excel has a bad habit of being unstable where the Libreoffice version of this is stable. Its like the problem you use to run into with master documents under MS office up until they removed them.

Libreoffice is trying to encourage macros done in way that if macros are disabled your document does not turn into a total non functional mess..

You would be thinking of Excel mean to connect macro straight to Cell. Is this a really good idea? Can the user when Macros are disabled clearly see what sections of the document are now no longer functional? that question explains why Libreoffice/openoffice/staroffice is the way they are.

This is a small difference that causes very big shock to system. Libreoffice/openoffice/staroffice(really old design choice here) you are meant to use form controls to connect up macros inside sheet so it clear a macro is connected at X instead of Excel straight to cell where it does not visible show.

Yes default form controls are off as well to attempt to discourage using this path if it not required. You find excel documents were people have duplicated the sum command with a macro so there are valid reasons not to make this easy.

So its not that it cannot be done its that Libreoffice expects this done differently and this does cause some problems. Yes between the security requirement and form control requirement this is a true shock to Excel users system moving to calc.

https://help.libreoffice.org/latest/en-US/text/sbasic/shared/uno_objects.html

The scripting support is not as basic as you are making out either. Issue here is the macro IDE does not hand hold person making macro enough to lead them to the function they want under libreoffice so they incorrectly believe the functionality is not there when you combined this with a few small design choice differences(I mean less than 20). You have a hell load of this does not work.

MS Office as yellow despite them having far superior language tools available,

Better IDE yes that true. But what the macros can do libreoffice in fact allows more.

Ease of use vs capability. MS Office has the ease of use in many places but when you dig in it short on capability. Libreoffice normally has the capability but the easy of use is another matter and quite commonly lacking.

LibreOffice keeps trying to claim feature support for things that require plugins that may or may not be updated in the future.

Look again everything need extension is marked in Red. Red is not supported. Of course providing the information for a person who has a problem right now they need to work around is a good thing.

Like it or not that chart is not as bias as it appears to you. Excel vs Calc there are not as many features different as one first presumes. But where they are different they really really hurt.

Yes trying to connect you macro to a cell inside Calc as you would in Excel and not being able to find sane way todo it means you are not looking for form controls that is the solution in libreoffice and releations. You go from Calc to Excel you go to hook up your macro in the normal Libreoffice way using form controls and now you have Excel random-ally crashing on your because you embedded form controls in Excel document. Either way your a screwed here. Some ways libreoffice may be annoying and time consuming when you don't know the correct method to use at least you don't end up with documents broken and non recoverable as you do with Excel when you do the wrong method causing excel to randomly crash.

Yes Excel trains users not to use form controls by breaking their documents and having the program crash. Not using forum controls means where macros are used on sheet are not clearly viable to users.

[oiaohm]

Good catch, it seems the cordiaupc font was not installed on this system (win11pro, side by side comparison of the three softwares), I should have check, my bad. After install, the display is correct in libreoffice and onlyoffice.
Still, I wonder if word use embedded font? the render seemed correct, even without the font installed?

https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/469461/location-of-fonts-downloaded-within-ms-word-powerpoint-etc

I know this is Apple. Yes MS Office has cloud fonts and will download missing fonts. 3 huge problems with MS cloud fonts.
1) What version font if you clear the cloud fonts and have word redownload due to get a different download server get a different font version welcome to great fun with documents not printing correctly due to slight font differences and having a hard time workout out why..
2) You might not have a version of the font you are in fact licensed to you to use. Yes MS cloud fonts will do this to you with the multi version thing.
3) MS Office can choose to delete download cloud fonts if it cannot connect to Microsoft website that provides fonts. Yes another case of why did my documents print wrong bugger me the network had a issue and MS Office decided to delete the cloud fonts just before I pressed print.

System installed font better chance of being legal and not going to pull the magic disappearing act on you. Of course system installed fonts under Windows may not always be legal for you to use either.

There is a lot more to these font issues than just messing up formatting.

Yes the font was installed somewhere for MS Office to work. Libreoffice would have picked up the documented embedded font if it was embedded. I would put my bet on MS Office using cloud fonts because the system font was not installed..

[kurkosdr]

No thanks!

I'll use Google Docs, I'll use Microsoft Office 365, I'll write my documents in Markdown or LaTeX, I'll give OnlyOffice a try, but I've given up on LibreOffice.

LibreOffice is old, outdated, ugly and not user-friendly.

OnlyOffice is a superior experience and has much better support for MS Word .doc/docx and .xls/xlsx documents. I gave Libreoffice an honest try, but it really does suck ass compared to other "free" word-processor/spreadsheet products currently available. OnlyOffice is also "open source" -- but has paid versions for corporate use.

The problem with Microsoft Office 365 and OnlyOffice is that they are online services. If you are the kind of person who has lots of doc and ppt files on their hard drive and wants to quickly open them without having to upload them to an online service, LibreOffice is pretyy good. Markdown and LaTex don't even open doc and ppt files, so they are irrelevant.

BTW LibreOffice has a ribbon interface, but the Document Foundation people have been keeping it as an experimental feature since forever for reasons only they know.

[kurkosdr]

image.png

Is there any way to make it even display icons in Kubuntu 24.10? It's not only that it's ugly. It's unusable.

Gotta love how FOSS software that works flawlessly on Windows will randomly fail on Desktop Linux. VLC has a similar problem, where depending on where you got it from, it may or may not have VAAPI or VDPAU acceleration, and may or may not ship with libdvdcss. Or OpenShot sometimes failing to launch on some distros.

And that's the chaos of "choice" and byzantine dependency trees. At least Windows is a fixed target.

Yes, I know... flatpak this and appimage that... I will believe it when I see it, aka when either of those becomes the default.