Snapcraft 6.0 Coming To Finally Move From Ubuntu 18.04 To 20.04 LTS Base, Phase Out i386

[jo-erlend]

You seem confused, the burden of proof here is entirely on you here since you are the one making positive claims about their proprietary software based on your own assumptions.

No. I am not making any claims about their proprietary systems at all. I have only told you what their official explanation is. You, however, made the claim that the way they have implemented their internal systems mean you only need to edit a couple of configuration files to use different implementations of things like their CDN and SSO. That sounds almost magical to me, so I would like to see you prove that claim. I have never heard of such a system before.

[RahulSundaram]

No. I am not making any claims about their proprietary systems at all. I have only told you what their official explanation is

No, you absolutely never linked to anything official. From the beginning of this conversation, you are merely stating your own assumptions and it changed from insecure harcoded passwords and bank accounts in scripts to to their use of SSO and the former conflicts with the latter assumptions so before you start asking for proof about industry standard protocols, you can back up your own claims first.

[mppix]

Complements, this post has the highest degree of moving the goalpost that I have seen on this forum (and there are some unliklely individuals here).

Because the developer hasn't maintained it, so when the API was changed, it became incompatible. How does that change anything I wrote?

There is still no open-source snap server...

That is a pure lie. I have never in my life said that Canonical's snap store is open source. I have tried to explain their explanation for keeping it proprietary and why it shouldn't matter to you at all. All the parts that are relevant to you, are open source, meaning the client and the API.

Yes, you did:

What does that mean? Snap is GPLv3. Why would that cause concerns?

Please do us a favor and skip the part where "you did not mean the server". The snap system does not work without it.
There are a ton of examples out there that have a closed-source server/open-source client but they usually don't claim to be an open-source system.

Flatpak is only used for apps. It is not a centralized software distribution. The similarities between Snap and FlatPak are superficial. They are very different things.

Afaik, snap is also used mainly for app distribution like flatpak is intended mainly for app distribution.

internal systems that are never supposed to be used by anyone else, are usually "poorly written", in the sense that they're not designed for public use. it is totally normal that internal systems are not generalized, because generalizing a system is expensive and why would you pay for that when you know that nobody else will ever use the system?

This is soo wrong.
There is a lot of very well written closed source software and there is poorly written open source software as well. This is also very unlikely a question of cost of generalization (usually you keep code and data separate anyway).

I don't really see how that is relevant to anything in this context.

Fine with me.

Then I don't understand why you're so passionate about running a clone of Canonical's snap store. My point and pretty much my only point, is that you shouldn't. If you want to run your own Linux distribution, then you should figure out for yourself what features you want to provide and how you want to provide them.

Let us get a few things straight:
- You started this conversation
- You claimed that snap is open source (and therefore everybody can do whatever they want with it, open source software style)

I have no desire to ship my own distribution because I am really happy with my debs, rpms, and flatpaks.
However, I am calling your BS.

Why would it be bloated? The packages are compressed and obviously, snap supports sharing dependencies. Snaps get access to whatever they need access to. That is what interfaces are for. You do not appear to know even the absolute basics of how snaps work and that puzzles me considering the enormously strong opinions you have. But this is all beside the point. I am not in any way trying make you like snaps. The only thing I'm saying, is that if you want to run a snap-based Linux distro or use snaps in your existing distro, then you should implement the API yourself.

Cm'on man.

It wasn't a quote at all. The documentation tells you that FlatPak is designed for desktops. If you want to explain how you would build an entire Linux distro using FlatPak only, I'd bee interested in hearing it. Because that's what snaps are designed for.

I am not interested in building an entire linux distribution in flatpak nor are snaps predominantly used this way.

[jo-erlend]

There is still no open-source snap server...

What? I just gave you an example of one. Not for you to use it, mind you, but to show how easy it is to implement one for your specific needs.

Please do us a favor and skip the part where "you did not mean the server". The snap system does not work without it.
There are a ton of examples out there that have a closed-source server/open-source client but they usually don't claim to be an open-source system.

A snap server is a simple web server implementing a simple JSON API that is Free Software. The snap system works perfectly well without any servers at all. I have my favorite snaps on my keyring. It is of no importance where snaps come from at all.

Afaik, snap is also used mainly for app distribution like flatpak is intended mainly for app distribution.

We don't know how many products are shipped with Ubuntu Core, but we do know that snaps are mostly popular for IoT and similar stuff with the desktop support lagging somewhat behind.

This is soo wrong.
There is a lot of very well written closed source software and there is poorly written open source software as well. This is also very unlikely a question of cost of generalization (usually you keep code and data separate anyway).

Have you ever written a backup script? If so, did you add support for all database management systems you don't use? Of course you don't. You build your internal system-specific system according to your specific needs.

- You claimed that snap is open source (and therefore everybody can do whatever they want with it, open source software style)

i have never said anything remotely similar to that. What i did say, is that the client and server API is Free Software, so if you want to run a snap store, you are entirely free to do so.

I am not interested in building an entire linux distribution in flatpak nor are snaps predominantly used this way.

[/QUOTE]

I don't know how many IoT devices are shipped with Ubuntu Core, but I do know that the Linux desktop world is fairly insignificant in comparison to ioT and servers. But considering you had never heard of Ubuntu Core before I told you about it, how come you're now an expert on its market share?

[mppix]

...

I think we can stop here. I did not see any new or relevant information in your answer.

[jo-erlend]

I think we can stop here. I did not see any new or relevant information in your answer.

I do have some relevant info now though, because a couple of days ago, there was news of a new open source snap server. I haven't tried it, but as I understand it, it supports pass-through to Canonical so that if your server doesn't have your distros packages, it can just use the one from the Canonical store seemlessly. i think the guy who wrote it is 13 or something and seems to have spent a couple of days on it. I wonder what that could possibly mean. Maybe I was right and it's not such a big deal to implement the API?

I can't find it at the moment, but it's the young and promising and productive guy behind the Ubuntu Unity project. I think he calls it lol store. For all I know, he got the inspiration from witnessing our conversation.