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GNOME 41 Alpha Released With Many Desktop Changes Accumulating

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  • #31
    Originally posted by rastersoft View Post

    Just install a couple of extensions and... BANG!
    Just install the next version of GNOME and... BANG! Extensions gone; have to upgrade them all and good luck with obscure/abandoned extensions

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    • #32
      Mez'
      Senior Member
      Mez'

      Let the specialists take care of those and use the resources to relieve the burden, i.e. develop and maintain the necessary options and customizations...
      I'd recommend you read this blog post:

      https://blogs.gnome.org/tbernard/202...unity-power-1/

      Especially this

      "This leads them to think that GNOME is developed by a centralized company with a hierarchical structure, where developers are assigned tasks by their manager, based on a roadmap set by higher management, with a marketing department coordinating public-facing messaging, and so on. Basically, they think we’re a tech company. "

      And this

      "General confusion around how resources are allocated (“Why are they working on X when they don’t even have Y?”)"

      It's from a Gnome community member but applies to most open source projects.
      tomas
      Senior Member
      Last edited by tomas; 20 July 2021, 06:58 AM.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post

        You mean this work of beauty you can only access if you minimize your windows https://ufo.ai/iconsareoverrated/5o791x8.png ? Everyone wants to get rid of them.
        You can fill your desk with all kinds of papers, documents, and stuff, you can keep it nice and clean, or you can do whatever works best for you. It's up to you.
        Are we throwing away desks because someone is messier than others?

        Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post
        Even microsoft and apple want to get rid of those 80s mistakes. If I give you 5 random applications with Menu Bars and tell you to find the settings in all of them on the first try, you will fail dramatically.
        Of course they want, that's why so many professional software tools have a menu bar.
        Actually, you might be right. I probably wouldn't find the settings at my first try, but the beauty of menu bars is that they're discoverable.
        They allow the user to glimpse at a large part of a software features and functionality just by browsing the menus.
        Classic menus also teach keyboard shortcuts by putting them right where the user is going to see them, without having to open a dedicated page.
        Windows may replace some of them with ribbons, aka tabbed toolbars, another old UI pattern that's nowhere to be seen in Gnome, but I don't think Visual Studio is going to ditch its menu any time soon. And neither is VSCode by the way.

        Also the global menu is one of the oldest and most defining characteristics of the Apple desktop experience. Do you think they'll get rid of it just for the lulz?

        Long story short, of course there will be other patterns and new patterns, but menu bars are not disappearing.

        Originally posted by Alexmitter View Post
        Microsoft wants to get rid of them and apple phased them out replacing them with small widgets that can actually display something useful if clicked.
        Maybe they want to, but they're not going to remove them while lots of software still use them.

        Comment


        • #34
          tomas
          Senior Member
          tomas
          Tobias Bernard's blog is useful to have an idea about where Gnome's design is going, but apart from that he's too opinionated for me and that casts a shadow on anything else he writes...
          By the way, he doesn't mention the fact that Gnome and Gtk are develped mostly by Red Hat. I'm not saying that they're the sole contributor, but they're by far the more important
          JackLilhammers
          Senior Member
          Last edited by JackLilhammers; 20 July 2021, 07:30 AM.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by JackLilhammers View Post
            [USER="102886"] Gnome and Gtk are develped mostly by Red Hat. I'm not saying that they're the sole contributor, but they're by far the more important
            Yes, so? He specifically mentions that the various components making up Gnome are developed by volunteers and companies:

            "The people actually making the product are either volunteers (and thus answer to nobody), or work for one of about a dozen companies employing people to work on various parts of GNOME. All of these companies have different interests and areas of focus depending on how they use GNOME, and tend to contribute accordingly."

            If you're a paying customer of RedHat, especially a major customer, then of course it's easier to influence where they should put their resources regarding Gnome.
            The misconception seems to be that people think developer resources are exchangeable and that the developers of say Epiphany can be directed to work on something completely different that the user deems more important. This is often not the case. Just as an example, the main contributors to Epiphany, Michael Catanzaro and Xan Lopez, are both employed by the consultancy firm Igalia. What does that tell us? That Igalia have one more more customers actually paying them to develop Epiphany. That might seem strange given the state of Epiphany compared to major browsers, but that is beside the point. Perhaps Epiphany is used in som kiosk mode somewhere or embedded into some product? I don't know.
            tomas
            Senior Member
            Last edited by tomas; 20 July 2021, 07:25 AM.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by JackLilhammers View Post
              tomas
              Senior Member
              tomas
              Tobias Bernard's blog is useful to have an idea about where Gnome's design is going, but a part from that he's too opinionated for me and that casts a shadow on anything else he writes...
              By the way, he doesn't mention the fact that Gnome and Gtk are develped mostly by Red Hat. I'm not saying that they're the sole contributor, but they're by far the more important
              His blog post was arrogance impersonated.
              It literally meant "we don't care one bit about what users think or want".

              Comment


              • #37
                I beg for support for bridged networking in Gnome Boxes . That's all

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by tomas View Post
                  Mez'
                  Senior Member
                  Mez'



                  I'd recommend you read this blog post:

                  https://blogs.gnome.org/tbernard/202...unity-power-1/

                  Especially this

                  "This leads them to think that GNOME is developed by a centralized company with a hierarchical structure, where developers are assigned tasks by their manager, based on a roadmap set by higher management, with a marketing department coordinating public-facing messaging, and so on. Basically, they think we’re a tech company. "

                  And this

                  "General confusion around how resources are allocated (“Why are they working on X when they don’t even have Y?”)"

                  It's from a Gnome community member but applies to most open source projects.
                  I am well aware of that. And nobody here thinks that's how they are structured.
                  But then why are the surrounding apps updates reported in the same news and not as a separate entity?

                  All I'm saying is: however you do it, use the resources more efficiently than for pointless NIH apps.
                  Mez'
                  Senior Member
                  Last edited by Mez'; 20 July 2021, 07:34 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Mez'
                    Senior Member
                    Mez'

                    His blog post was arrogance impersonated. It literally meant "we don't care one bit about what users think or want".
                    How so? Be specific. And I'm not talking about his latest post in this series, part 4, which (rightfully in my opinion) got criticized also within the Gnome community.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Mez' View Post
                      All I'm saying is: however you do it, use the resources more efficiently than for pointless NIH apps.
                      Please see my follow-up post here

                      https://www.phoronix.com/forums/foru...76#post1268476

                      regarding this issue, specifically taking Epiphany as an example.

                      Comment

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