No announcement yet.

Firefox 90 Released With FTP Support Removed, Better WebRender Software Performance

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #21
    Originally posted by Awesomeness View Post
    I hope they'll remove HTTP 1.x next.
    I hope not. HTTP/1.x is 100% usable in a plain terminal session and is great for debugging while HTTP/2 and higher is a binary protocol.
    Last edited by avem; 13 July 2021, 02:37 PM.


    • #22
      Firefox didin't offer much when it comes to FTP, and they may want to do things that will break that code.
      I do use FTP but on the command line, with ncftp.


      • #23
        Originally posted by dreich View Post
        Mozilla is no stranger to the concept of cramming more stuff on their product to increase the perceived value. FTP, bittorrent and other protocols should not be available through a web browser. There are simple clients without heaps of dependencies, wide ranging support for all sorts of platforms, headless operation, etc than web browsers.
        Well, some years ago Firefox "extension" is flexible enough for people to implement advanced FTP client or bittorrent client into the browser. Now all of them are gone. If it is still possible to implement other protocols into Firefox by extension, I guess nobody will complain the loss of built-in support.


        • #24
          Originally posted by bug77 View Post
          Those are all internet-related protocols. What makes the cut for a web browser and what doesn't is a fine line.
          I would expect a web browser to only include functionality needed for browsing the web, which has always meant HTML documents. To have it support other application protocols sounds like a violation of the Unix Philosophy


          • #25
            Originally posted by Awesomeness View Post
            I hope they'll remove HTTP 1.x next.
            why not just remove http(s) completely? and then javascript should be next too. only then will firefox finally stop being bloat.


            • #26
              Originally posted by bug77 View Post
              I wonder what they had against FTP? He never hurt no one...
              It meant more code to maintain that barely anyone ever used.


              • #27
                Originally posted by microcode View Post
                Really don't get what's gained by dropping the FTP browser... I get that it's becoming fringe over time, but a) I think most people who use FTP occasionally rely on the browser to do it and b) lots of web pages have FTP links in them. Not to mention FTPS, which is included in this change.
                The issue is that FTP is a notoriously insecure protocol and the average user may not see if it's being used on a page. The issue is not about typing an "ftp://" URL directly, which means that you know what you're doing, but what if a malicious web site incorporates references or links to FTP URLs? You might be browsing the web as usual and not even realize that you're using FTP. That's kinda terrifying.

                Note that Firefox still lets you register scheme handlers. So you could potentially have an "ftp://" link automatically open Filezilla or whatever FTP client you want in case you encounter such unfortunate links on the web.


                • #28
                  Originally posted by kpedersen View Post

                  Web browsers already do much more than they should do. Firefox absolutely spams you with their "services" like sync and Firefox monitor. Why not leave in modules that were actually useful?

                  It goes without saying that telemetry and spying are beyond the job description of a browser
                  Sync is a service that allows you to sync your browser settings across different browser instances. Firefox monitor is a (rather useful I'd say) service that allows you to become aware if and when any of your bazillion accounts has been exposed via a hack or leak or some such. Both of them have 100% to do with the browser itself and/or with browsing the modern web, both of them are useful, so neither of them is spam or "much more than [a browser] should do".

                  On the other hand, FTP is a practically dead protocol that has nothing to do with browsing the modern web and everything to do with browsing the ancient web of the '90s-'00s, and which prime functionality (moving files to and fro) has been superseded by other, more capable and secure protocols since ages ago. So, an FTP client tacked on to a modern browser? Now that's a useless feature to keep around if I've ever seen one, especially if we consider that there also exist far more capable standalone FTP clients out there.

                  Also, telemetry may be undesirable to some people and abused by some entities, but it's not spying and it is (or can be) part of the job description of any software that wants to know how its users use it, including a browser.


                  • #29
                    97.8% of "big brain" Firefox user comments:

                    a) "China is spying on everyone. So is big tech with their censorship. [Insert nonsensical privacy/security concerns here]"

                    b) *useless feature(s) gets deprecated/removed* "WAAAHHHHH. I want and need Firefox to be able to monitor my blood sugar while I set the timer on my microwave through my Firefox account"


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by avem View Post
                      FTP is just a bad protocol overall:
                      • Requires two (control/data) connections thus works badly via NAT
                      • 100% insecure and allows to modify files en route
                      • Doesn't support any encrypted methods of authentication (e.g. SCRAM)
                      • REST is not always implemented
                      • Bad error handling
                      Honestly most people don't care. The ones who still use it, are welcome to use native FTP clients like Filezilla.

                      Not only that, but it also takes longer to retrieve a file via FTP than HTTP. 5 commands to get a file in FTP vs. 1 in HTTP.

                      Also one day I got a corrupt file because I forgot to set a binary mode or something.....