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GNOME Shell + Mutter 40 Beta Released With Wayland Improvements, Overview Redesign

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  • rastersoft
    replied
    Originally posted by birdie View Post
    This "advantage" also means you cannot create compositor-independent utilities implementing e.g. screen recording or casting.
    Pipewire.

    Leave a comment:


  • birdie
    replied
    Originally posted by Hibbelharry View Post

    Jeez.

    At first: There isn't much improving for X11, albeit all its shortcomings. X11 development is mostly dead, the last releases are getting quite old. If nothing really happens, there is nothing to report. Except for XWayland, thats part of X and for the most part the best maintained piece of X11.

    Second argument, tied to the first: Wayland and projects surrounding it are the place where improvements happen nowadays. Wayland got traction and the speed of improvements won't slow down in the foreseeable future, so you'll get news about Wayland.

    You will now surely answer that it's no wonder considering all the shortcomings of wayland and more shortsighted yada yada but effectively that will not respect the fact, that there are some pretty nice advantages in wayland, getting even stronger and today outpacing X11 in many areas, that are part of that news stream.
    I'm aware of this great Wayland "advantage": it's not really usable outside of Gnome/KDE and each DE/WM must create a full-featured compositing manager implementing a metric ton of APIs which are not part of the Wayland protocol. This "advantage" also means you cannot create compositor-independent utilities implementing e.g. screen recording or casting.

    Here's another great "advantage": applications running under Wayland compositors are glued to it, so if the compositor crashes, all your apps crash momentarily with it. The funny thing is that it's not the case for X.org, Windows, MacOS where apps will continue to run in case the window manager has stopped working.

    So many advantages!

    Leave a comment:


  • Mez'
    replied
    Originally posted by Hibbelharry View Post
    You will now surely answer that it's no wonder considering all the shortcomings of wayland and more shortsighted yada yada
    Shortsightedness is to dismiss and ignore said shortcomings and move on at any cost while the experience is still sub-par.

    The correct approach would be to acknowledge and address the huge list of issues without the kind of arrogance or bigotism we've seen and help users ramp up to a wayland experience that satisfies them. Before trying to convince everyone that it's the way to go, they should make it the actual way to go.

    Until then, we'll have to mention wayland improvements, as they are much needed to reach parity for everyone, not just for the most basic workflows.
    Last edited by Mez'; 23 February 2021, 08:36 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hibbelharry
    replied
    Originally posted by birdie View Post
    Sorry to crap on this parade but when will the stream of "X, Y, Z has improved support for Wayland" end? I thought at least Gnome/Mutter has supported Wayland perfectly for at least a couple of years now. When was the last time you read, "Something has improved support for X.org"? I don't remember such news pieces at all actually.
    Jeez.

    At first: There isn't much improving for X11, albeit all its shortcomings. X11 development is mostly dead, the last releases are getting quite old. If nothing really happens, there is nothing to report. Except for XWayland, thats part of X and for the most part the best maintained piece of X11.

    Second argument, tied to the first: Wayland and projects surrounding it are the place where improvements happen nowadays. Wayland got traction and the speed of improvements won't slow down in the foreseeable future, so you'll get news about Wayland.

    You will now surely answer that it's no wonder considering all the shortcomings of wayland and more shortsighted yada yada but effectively that will not respect the fact, that there are some pretty nice advantages in wayland, getting even stronger and today outpacing X11 in many areas, that are part of that news stream.

    Leave a comment:


  • fguerraz
    replied
    Originally posted by birdie View Post
    Sorry to crap on this parade but when will the stream of "X, Y, Z has improved support for Wayland" end? I thought at least Gnome/Mutter has supported Wayland perfectly for at least a couple of years now. When was the last time you read, "Something has improved support for X.org"? I don't remember such news pieces at all actually.
    Yeah, totally with you here. Same for the Linux kernel, WHEN WILL IT FINALLY BE COMPLETE? I mean look at Solaris, when was the last time they had to improve something? They clearly nailed down perfection years ago.

    Leave a comment:


  • birdie
    replied
    Sorry to crap on this parade but when will the stream of "X, Y, Z has improved support for Wayland" end? I thought at least Gnome/Mutter has supported Wayland perfectly for at least a couple of years now. When was the last time you read, "Something has improved support for X.org"? I don't remember such news pieces at all actually.

    Leave a comment:


  • rastersoft
    replied
    I only hope that the changes don't break DING or ActivityAppLauncher.

    Leave a comment:


  • uid313
    replied
    I hope to see the ArcMenu and Dash-to-panel extensions get updated soon.

    I like GNOME overall, but I don't like the default user experience and much prefer GNOME with the addition of ArcMenu and Dash-to-panel.

    Leave a comment:


  • GNOME Shell + Mutter 40 Beta Released With Wayland Improvements, Overview Redesign

    Phoronix: GNOME Shell + Mutter 40 Beta Released With Wayland Improvements, Overview Redesign

    GNOME 40 beta is coming together with the GNOME Shell and Mutter components having seen new releases on Monday...

    http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...Mutter-40-Beta
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