Firefox 83 vs. Chrome 87 On Intel Tiger Lake + AMD Renoir Under Linux

[duby229]

Firefox Wayland crashes less than X.org for me, so joke is on you.

And is not just Arch, Pop OS and Fedora show the same behavior for me the only thing i don't have to test is an Intel IGP.

And yet the point still stands, Chromium derivatives are faster and more stable and are even more advanced that Firefox(Vulkan is working great already on all derivatives releases).

Another issue i noticed is that Firefox rendering on Linux at least seem to clog hard the first render on big DOMs and animated GIF/videos on heavy sites simply stop loading after few scrolls down(9gag for example) whereas Chromium just pop things on the screen for me, also when you inspect a big DOM Firefox suffer a lot to render, sure chromium also take some hits but is visually a lot faster

Funny thing is, I haven't had an Xorg crash in something like 10 or so years. But every Wayland compositor I've ever tried has been horribly incomplete and buggy and some of them do crash even still. And the Wayland situation has been pretty much the same for like 12 or 13 years now...

[birdie]

Firefox Wayland crashes less than X.org for me, so joke is on you.

And is not just Arch, Pop OS and Fedora show the same behavior for me the only thing i don't have to test is an Intel IGP.

And yet the point still stands, Chromium derivatives are faster and more stable and are even more advanced that Firefox(Vulkan is working great already on all derivatives releases).

Another issue i noticed is that Firefox rendering on Linux at least seem to clog hard the first render on big DOMs and animated GIF/videos on heavy sites simply stop loading after few scrolls down(9gag for example) whereas Chromium just pop things on the screen for me, also when you inspect a big DOM Firefox suffer a lot to render, sure chromium also take some hits but is visually a lot faster

The joke is indeed on you as again I don't remember the last time X.org crashed on me. Was it 15 years ago? 20? I don't remember frankly. Oh, I use proprietary "bad" NVIDIA drivers which have been rock solid for me unlike Intel/AMD which I remember crashed a lot, right.

Chrome derivatives might be faster but they are 20 times less customizable and have fewer add-ons. Lastly Firefox on Windows is crazy fast.

[jrch2k8]

I guess my particular problems with chromium is not at runtime but rather at compile-time. It usually craps out on a build error, which indicates to me very poor testing. (And most likely undefined behavior if you can manage to hack it enough to get it to build)

I have issues with that as well, mostly because of the sheer size of it, it need lots of RAM to build initially or else you get plagued with fails.

I honestly believe they should chop the code base into smaller projects/libraries that can be build independently and/or release independently which should make patching and maintenance easier.

But it is what it is, i guess

[duby229]

Nothing pertaining to the issue we've really had and which has been raised just recently. Sorry, your GPL belligerence doesn't even have proper confirmations/proofs (most links are old as f-k) but sure "NVIDIA is bad".

The kernel is -STILL- GPLv2 Only, that hasn't changed in all these years. Just because a conversation is old doesn't change the reasoning of the conversation.

And yes, for those exact reasons stated in those conversations, nVidia is in fact bad. That's definitely true.

[rabcor]

This article explains perfectly why I reluctantly stay on Chrome despite philosophically preferring Firefox (except on Android, on Android firefox is the only proper browser...)

[birdie]

The kernel is -STILL- GPLv2 Only, that hasn't changed in all these years. Just because a conversation is old doesn't change the reasoning of the conversation.

And yes, for those exact reasons stated in those conversations, nVidia is in fact bad. That's definitely true.

You confuse your attitude towards them with the status quo as in reality they are neither bad, nor good. But then I'm preaching to deaf ears since you cannot even provide proofs that NVIDIA is actually abusing GPL. None of the provided URLs contain anything of the sort. And with that I want to end this NVIDIA related discussion here.

[jrch2k8]

The joke is indeed on you as again I don't remember the last time X.org crashed on me. Was it 15 years ago? 20? I don't remember frankly. Oh, I use proprietary "bad" NVIDIA drivers which have been rock solid for me unlike Intel/AMD which I remember crashed a lot, right.

Chrome derivatives might be faster but they are 20 times less customizable and have fewer add-ons. Lastly Firefox on Windows is crazy fast.

Again, nothing crashes for me on Wayland or X.org except for Firefox, this means:

Blender: no crash ever
GIMP: no crash ever
PiTiVi/OpenShot: no crash ever
Native Linux games(steam 20+ so far): no crash ever
Chromium(brave, opera, edge, vivaldi, gnome web browser): no crash ever
Gnome(Wayland or X.org): No crashes since 3.22 on either
Lutris+DXVK games(Wine or ProtonGE, 50+ games plus an extreme modded SkyrimSE +ENB): no crash ever
Libreoffice 5/6/7: No crashes ever
VScode, Litecode, CODE::BLOCKS, builder: no crash ever
SVP4+MPV+AV1 video player(OpenGL/Vulkan+custom SSR shaders): no crash ever
Virtualization(passthrough or virtio-GPU): no crash ever

So on and so forth, its ONLY FIREFOX nothing else but FIREFOX <-- is it clear now?

In not relevant if on X.org or Wayland, since the list above apply to BOTH and in BOTH is ONLY FIREFOX and FIREFOX ONLY that crashes <-- is it clear now?

[jrch2k8]

Funny thing is, I haven't had an Xorg crash in something like 10 or so years. But every Wayland compositor I've ever tried has been horribly incomplete and buggy and some of them do crash even still. And the Wayland situation has been pretty much the same for like 12 or 13 years now...

If you use nVidia hardware this will not change any time soon and stick to X.org, now if you are on AMD GCN card(HD7000 +) then Wayland should work perfectly fine on most compositors as long you have at least LLVM 11 and Mesa 20(i have a Polaris and Cape Verde cards and both handle Gnome Wayland flawlessly)

[duby229]

You confuse your attitude towards them with the status quo as in reality they are neither bad, nor good. But then I'm preaching to deaf ears since you cannot even provide proofs that NVIDIA is actually abusing GPL. None of the provided URLs contain anything of the sort. And with that I want to end this NVIDIA related discussion here.

Fair enough, except that those conversations I linked to do in fact address exactly the situation nVidia keeps putting themselves in.
I highly advise you to search for gpl_only

Here's one for you, notice how many different times nVidia gets caught using internal interfaces to hide their kernel modifications inside their binary. Time after time and year after year. Each and every single one of these is a gpl violation as was described by the conversations linked to in my earlier post.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=gpl-only+%...248-7__&ia=web

[sa666666]

You confuse your attitude towards them with the status quo as in reality they are neither bad, nor good. But then I'm preaching to deaf ears since you cannot even provide proofs that NVIDIA is actually abusing GPL. None of the provided URLs contain anything of the sort. And with that I want to end this NVIDIA related discussion here.

Then why did you come here and START THE F(#%(&ing conversation? You must be some sort of masochist or something. You started talking about Nvidia, GPL2, etc. Nobody mentioned it until you brought it up. It's like you want to constantly bring this into every conversation here on Phoronix, and when you don't get people to engage, you keep escalating it. Your posts started out fine, but each time you responded, it became more and more unrelated to the topic at hand, and you became more and more rude. At this point I'm really starting to think your trolling is a result of some mental issue. WHY DO YOU KEEP COMING BACK HERE? Oh, right, we all know why.