GTK+ 4.0 Likely Being Released In Spring Of 2019

[Degra]

Metal 2 API is system-wide. The graphics capabilities of OS X are light years ahead. What people mock are old OpenGL stacks and now that Apple modernized its OCL and rolled it into Metal 2 API they're bitching about that as well.

GTK as well as Qt are working on running on top of Vulkan instead of OpenGL in future versions though.
Yes, Apple is faster, but not by that much.
GTK4 will be running on top of Vulkan.
Qt is working on the same thing, but Qt6 is some way off.

GNOME devs are thinking about making a Gnome Shell 4, so it'll be more wayland native than the retrofitted Gnome Shell 3, and while they're at it they can also convert their DE stack from OpenGL to Vulkan there as well.

[DMJC]

"Wayland Fanboys"... go buy a modern UHD screen and see how far along you get with X. Especially mixed-dpi.

Mixed DPI works fine on my home setup, guess you just need to learn howto use xrandr.

[Zyklon]

Mixed DPI works fine on my home setup, guess you just need to learn howto use xrandr.

Why should I?
So in your opinion, I install Linux on my mother’s machine and tell her to RTFM and learn xrandr?

That’s the whole point of Wayland – to forget about that shitty X stuff.

[DMJC]

Why should I?
So in your opinion, I install Linux on my mother’s machine and tell her to RTFM and learn xrandr?

That’s the whole point of Wayland – to forget about that shitty X stuff.

Wayland doesn't automate that stuff away, really you just want arandr and gnome-control-centre to be updated to let you set the DPI settings graphically. X11's API already has support for this. It's not X11 that's the problem. It's the tools that access X11 that suck. Typical Linux problems. You don't throw out the entire graphics stack when a simple tool can be modified/made to fix the problem. That's half the reason why the platform doesn't progress. Because people that don't understand it try to rewrite everything all the time. Xrandr already lets you set DPI on a per-screen basis. Arandr and gnome-control-centre don't because they need to be updated to add the functionality Xrandr already has, go lobby the desktop developers and leave the X11 driver stack writers alone. They already built what you want.

[Zyklon]

Your argument makes every single distribution and all of the desktop environments superfluous…

If for example the Fedora guys want to implement Wayland, why don’t you just let them do that? You don’t pay them, yet you want to tell them what to do? I don’t get that. I’m very satisfied with their Wayland implementation!

[miabrahams]

Mixed DPI works fine on my home setup, guess you just need to learn howto use xrandr.

I have to use xrandr to downscale my side monitors from 2880x1620 to 1920x1080. The blur and ringing is quite nasty. I can't wait until the desktop evolves past xrandr.

[DMJC]

I have to use xrandr to downscale my side monitors from 2880x1620 to 1920x1080. The blur and ringing is quite nasty. I can't wait until the desktop evolves past xrandr.

are you using resolution or --output devicename --scale ? I use a 12" screen at 2560x1440 with xrandr --output eDP1 --scale 0.6x0.6 and a 24" monitor at 2560x1440 with default scale of 1x1. A simple right click menu in arandr, or a dropdown menu from the arandr menu bar could fix this problem. There is no ringing or bluriness because the monitor is running at it's native resolution. It's Mate that's being scaled.

[dkasak]

Continuous churn of API/ABI guarantees that GNU/Linux desktop market share will always be below < 2%. It is great for bash, make, gcc and other command line tools, but the average Joe is not going to ever use it.

Hahahaha! The average Joe doesn't know what you're talking about when you incorrectly claim "Continuous churn of API/ABI".

[dkasak]

With OSX support being ... sub-optimal ... which I assume is a symptom of there not being any OSX devs interesting in hacking on gtk ... I wonder if anyone is going to be interested in porting gtk+ to metal ... or whatever new API Apple are pushing after metal. Seems kinda dangerous to rely on vulkan.

[starshipeleven]

Insert any criticism, and all you can say is "I'm not your slave, not gonna do it"?

All I can say is that they have their own development needs and limitations too (as they need to maintain and evolve the library too), and since in most cases you aren't paying them at all you have even less bargaining power than on Windows.

Really, you can just use the same library at a frozen old version, why would they have to go as hard as Microsoft (that still does not really do a particulalry good job) at keeping strong stability.

Yeah, that sure sounds like it's gonna break that 2% barrier anytime soon.

There are multiple ways to solve the same issues, flatpack would be the only realistic solution given the premises and environment (see also answers below).

As said in other threads, forcing perfect stability is not feasible in many cases, and even when it is possible it rises costs exponentially because of QA and code compexity you accumulate in your library. Windows kinda does it but wastes a lot of resources in doing so. Apple and Google also do, but they have less legacy bullshit so they have much less to deal with.

For example, Android (which is as popular as Windows, and repelled a Windows foray into its own domain) does sandboxing, each application ships its own stuff in its own sandbox. Sure they have versioned OS libraries too.

Just FYI calling them retarded isn't exactly wanting them to be "slaves",

You did both, separately. You call them names, AND you request them to do only what you require, disregarding their own needs.

If GTK didn't get updated anymore, to me that's a good thing, at least we'd get stability. And after a while, maybe just maybe, someone else will pick up and design a stable toolkit, and do a better job at it so we can finally have a sane userland.

You are a fool if you think this will change, the only things that are kept stable-ish no matter what are the costs are the core OS libraries in proprietary OSes because they want to lock you into their OS. Even third party libraries on windows do the same as on opensource, as they can't just suck your sock for free.

I cannot take any "approach" that needs sandboxing as anything than a pathetic workaround for core issues that shouldn't exist in the first place.

I'm very happy to hear that, I don't want you doing important stuff I'm going to rely on in the future.