NetBSD On The State & Future Of X.Org/X11

[phoronix]

Phoronix: NetBSD On The State & Future Of X.Org/X11

While on Linux the desktop environments, graphics stack, and other application software is steadily adopting Wayland support and focusing less on X11/X.Org support, the state of Wayland support and the open-source graphics driver stack in general is less robust among the BSDs. The NetBSD project published a status report around their ongoing dependence and modifications to their X.Org stack...

https://www.phoronix.com/news/NetBSD-State-Of-X11-2024

[Jumbotron]

At this point in the face of inevitability if you haven’t made clear tangible progress in moving over to Wayland and completely shutting off X support with only Xwayland for compatibility then you’re not a systems engineer. You’re a zealot. Every year the BSDs become just a little more irrelevant. Wayland is not a shiny new squirrel. It’s your inevitable future. If you don’t have the time, resources, engineering skill or requisite number of contributors, then it’s time to retire your project. If Wayland is not the default for all BSDs even with X still an option at install by 2026, it’s time for a mass migration away from BSDs. This zealotry nonsense needs to be squashed.

[cakeisamadeupdrug]

Wow such vitriol in the comments above about not just NetBSD, but all of the BSDs. I may be speaking from complete ignorance here, but are FreeBSD and OpenBSD not most commonly used in headless servers? Why would it be such an imperative to ship Wayland in an OS that by default doesn't even ship with a GUI? I used to run FreeBSD on a laptop, mostly as a learning experience and my god was it that, but it was invaluable in retrospect.

[avis]

If by “shiny new squirrels” she means Wayland, she’s an idiot who can’t be taken seriously. Wayland isn’t new anymore. FreeBSD and OpenBSD already did the vast majority of the work NetBSD needs, including epoll-shim and porting libinput to wscons.

NetBSD has no excuse anymore to not support Wayland. It seems poor decisions plague NetBSD since they kicked out Theo in 1994, and the remaining people are fuddy-duddies clinging to 20th century ideas... hence why NetBSD has been utterly irrelevant for the last quarter-century and only continues to decline.

Apparently it’s a “she”

You could have disagreed without insulting the woman twice.

[avis]

At this point in the face of inevitability if you haven’t made clear tangible progress in moving over to Wayland and completely shutting off X support with only Xwayland for compatibility then you’re not a systems engineer. You’re a zealot. Every year the BSDs become just a little more irrelevant. Wayland is not a shiny new squirrel. It’s your inevitable future. If you don’t have the time, resources, engineering skill or requisite number of contributors, then it’s time to retire your project. If Wayland is not the default for all BSDs even with X still an option at install by 2026, it’s time for a mass migration away from BSDs. This zealotry nonsense needs to be squashed.

The future which is fragmented as hell and which is not the same for its users. I don't want this future. I want to use anything which offers Wayland and enjoy all the features of the protocol. At the moment there's just one (!) full-featured Wayland implementation (for the current state of the protocol which still lacks a ton of crucial features including absolute window positioning) and that's KWin. And don't BS me with "it will all come in time", it has not in 15 years and it will not considering how much resources a complete implementation requires.

Of course, now this message will receive a handful of replies "It work for me with this godforsaken Wayland manager". I don't bloody care that "it works for you". Lots of gifted Linux users use console, your anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. When people open Windows/MacOS, they don't start Googling "why this or that feature doesn't work?", they just use it. With Wayland? Use KWin or get bloody wrecked.

So much for your inevitable future.

[User29]

If by “shiny new squirrels” she means Wayland, she’s an idiot who can’t be taken seriously.

Oh yeah, the elitist BSD ethos.

The real reason behind the slow development of BSDs is not that they are so patient adopting new ideas, security focused and conservative in decision making, concerning the needs and safety of their users. The real reason is, that no one is really interested in their slowly dying pet project. Which is a bit sad, because IMHO a good, healthy competition would make linux better product.

[ezst036]

The future which is fragmented as hell and which is not the same for its users.

X is also fragmented as well, as you have been reminded of many, many times.

You simply don't listen and repeat the same debunked nonsense.

[avis]

You are a boring, repetitive and spammer moron. How much time do you want to be ridiculous with that stupid issue in freedesktop tracker? Do you have a life outside computes? Best regards !

A comment must have actual content. Yours is empty except for insults.

It's weird that Wayland proponents, most of whom have not donated a single penny to the betterment of open source, feel the need to insult others who simply want to fully utilize their PCs.

[mrg666]

Looking at this

https://w3techs.com/technologies/details/os-bsd

Happy to see that BSD is not anywhere close to influence open source and Linux. X11 fans have a place to go though, good for them.

[woddy]

The future which is fragmented as hell and which is not the same for its users. I don't want this future. I want to use anything which offers Wayland and enjoy all the features of the protocol. At the moment there's just one (!) full-featured Wayland implementation (for the current state of the protocol which still lacks a ton of crucial features including absolute window positioning) and that's KWin. And don't BS me with "it will all come in time", it has not in 15 years and it will not considering how much resources a complete implementation requires.

Of course, now this message will receive a handful of replies "It work for me with this godforsaken Wayland manager". I don't bloody care that "it works for you". Lots of gifted Linux users use console, your anecdotal evidence is anecdotal. When people open Windows/MacOS, they don't start Googling "why this or that feature doesn't work?", they just use it. With Wayland? Use KWin or get bloody wrecked.

So much for your inevitable future.

But the positioning of the window cannot be an excuse, come on... it's not even an obligation eh!
No one argued that Windows 7 was shit because it didn't have virtual desktops.