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PulseAudio Lands Much Better Support For FreeBSD - Audio Now Plays Correctly

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    shanedav4
    Junior Member

  • shanedav4
    replied
    Why would BSD move to an audio system that the Linux community is trying really hard to leave behind. Pipewire is far better than PulseAudio. It's so much better that Fedora is making it the default sound system in the next release. I'm using it on Arch as a drop in replacement for PulseAudio and it performs great.

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  • trasz
    Phoronix Member

  • trasz
    replied
    Originally posted by bug77 View Post
    Ok, it's pretty clear by now you're either clueless or have a problem putting thoughts into words, but I'll bite once again.

    How is a piece of GPL code proprietary? How is it undocumented when you have the source code available?
    Just like OSS, ALSA provides an interface which you're free to implement however you want. You don't get more than one implementation simply because ALSA is geared towards Linux and, unlike OSS (which, incidentally, actually went proprietary at some point), never needed a complete rewrite.



    It's actually not explained above, you haven't provided a single example.
    GPL can be proprietary in exactly the same way any commercial piece of code can be: it's introduced unilaterally by a single vendor, ignoring existing standards and APIs, its license prevents reuse for other Open Source projects, and basically the only thing you can do is to rewrite it from scratch, like with any other proprietary API - except that you don't have documentation. And no, code is not documentation; it's quite obvious to everyone apart from fanboys and perhaps newbies.

    As for explanations - you might have missed previous four pages of comments about PulseAudio, which mostly serves as a workaround for ALSA deficiencies.
    trasz
    Phoronix Member
    Last edited by trasz; 20 January 2021, 03:15 PM.

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  • trasz
    Phoronix Member

  • trasz
    replied
    Originally posted by doom_Oo7 View Post

    just from a quick glance in my ~Documents folder I have wav files going from 8000 to 22050 to 32000, 44100, 48000, 96000, in 8, 16, 24, and 32 bits.
    Let's just say I wouldn't call that a typical desktop usage scenario ;-)
    trasz
    Phoronix Member
    Last edited by trasz; 20 January 2021, 03:15 PM.

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  • k1e0x
    Senior Member

  • k1e0x
    replied
    Originally posted by Sonadow View Post
    FreeBSD (and all of the BSDs, actually) are just so far behind in application and driver support that they can hardly be considered for any half-serious desktop computing use.

    The only Unix system that actually shines as a desktop and laptop OS is macOS.
    I use FreeBSD as a workstation. Why? It's a simple system and it runs well. Have you actually tried it?

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  • bug77
    Senior Member

  • bug77
    replied
    Originally posted by trasz View Post
    Yes, ALSA is GPL, which changes exactly nothing when it comes to it being proprietary and largely undocumented.
    Ok, it's pretty clear by now you're either clueless or have a problem putting thoughts into words, but I'll bite once again.

    How is a piece of GPL code proprietary? How is it undocumented when you have the source code available?
    Just like OSS, ALSA provides an interface which you're free to implement however you want. You don't get more than one implementation simply because ALSA is geared towards Linux and, unlike OSS (which, incidentally, actually went proprietary at some point), never needed a complete rewrite.

    Originally posted by trasz View Post
    As for functionality: ALSA does have some features that OSS (probably) doesn't, like the ability to record lots of channels at the same time. On the other hand it's missing functionality actually important for everyday use, as explained above, and which has to be patched/worked around by PulseAudio.
    It's actually not explained above, you haven't provided a single example.

    Leave a comment:

  • doom_Oo7
    Senior Member

  • doom_Oo7
    replied
    Originally posted by trasz View Post

    Implementing mixing in the kernel instead of separate daemon, libraries etc results in orders of magnitude fewer lines of code - entire mixing and resampling code (sys/dev/sound/pcm/feeder_*.c) is about four thousand lines of code. It doesn't use floating-point, for obvious reasons. To compare, the hda(4) driver alone is eleven thousand.

    As for resampling - can you tell some more? Eg can you give me some example of weird sampling frequencies and sample widths in various samples and streams found on your system?
    just from a quick glance in my ~Documents folder I have wav files going from 8000 to 22050 to 32000, 44100, 48000, 96000, in 8, 16, 24, and 32 bits.
    Also most video content on the internet is 48khz, not 44100.

    Leave a comment:

  • Siuoq
    Phoronix Member

  • Siuoq
    replied
    Originally posted by Lance View Post
    I have different experience. I used FreeBSD (GhostBSD) for Audio recordings and had far better Audio Quality than in Windows and Linux.
    Unbelievable! Any idea why?

    Leave a comment:

  • trasz
    Phoronix Member

  • trasz
    replied
    Originally posted by bug77 View Post

    Wth, ALSA is GPL. As for missing functionality, it has more than OSS does.
    Yes, ALSA is GPL, which changes exactly nothing when it comes to it being proprietary and largely undocumented.

    As for functionality: ALSA does have some features that OSS (probably) doesn't, like the ability to record lots of channels at the same time. On the other hand it's missing functionality actually important for everyday use, as explained above, and which has to be patched/worked around by PulseAudio.

    Leave a comment:

  • trasz
    Phoronix Member

  • trasz
    replied
    Originally posted by dreich View Post

    Adding more code, no matter how simple it is, results in higher orders of complexity.




    All the time.
    Also keep in mind that resampling, apart from sample rate conversions, also includes bit-depth conversions and all the above need to be done with floating-point precision.
    Implementing mixing in the kernel instead of separate daemon, libraries etc results in orders of magnitude fewer lines of code - entire mixing and resampling code (sys/dev/sound/pcm/feeder_*.c) is about four thousand lines of code. It doesn't use floating-point, for obvious reasons. To compare, the hda(4) driver alone is eleven thousand.

    As for resampling - can you tell some more? Eg can you give me some example of weird sampling frequencies and sample widths in various samples and streams found on your system?
    trasz
    Phoronix Member
    Last edited by trasz; 20 January 2021, 11:16 AM.

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  • bug77
    Senior Member

  • bug77
    replied
    Originally posted by trasz View Post

    There are two fundamental differences between those two: first, ALSA is proprietary and mostly undocumented, which makes it harder for people to use it directly. Second, it's missing some basic functionality which needs to be patched over, as seen above.

    The network part of PulseAudio could make some sense, if it worked.
    Wth, ALSA is GPL. As for missing functionality, it has more than OSS does.

    Leave a comment:

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