BeOS-Inspired Haiku ARM64 Upstreaming Started, AMD Ryzen Workarounds Added

[phoronix]

Phoronix: BeOS-Inspired Haiku ARM64 Upstreaming Started, AMD Ryzen Workarounds Added

We are approaching the one year anniversary since the Haiku R1 Beta and the developers working on this open-source BeOS-inspired operating system are as busy as ever with improvements...

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Haiku-Media-Keys-ARM64-More

[tuxd3v]

It would be nice, to run some bench tests, on the ARM port..
Comparing several boards..

That would give us an idea, of performance, also memory usage( which is a very important fact in the sbc world.. )

[cipri]

I think around 2013, I was insisting at the haiku-community, the give priority to ARM... which didnt happen. Now there is a chance again...this time with risc-v. If they manage to port haiku to risc-v on time, they might get more attention and gain more supporters. After Risc-V becomes mainstream (and it has all the opportunities) then the wow effect of haiku running on risc-v , wouldn't be as important. I would completely abandon the ARM port.

[wizard69]

Im not sure it would make a difference. Like ARM you would need viable RISC-V hardware for people to get excited about. It is only recently that ARM even became a thing, that is hardware suitable for advance user focused OS’s.

I think around 2013, I was insisting at the haiku-community, the give priority to ARM... which didnt happen. Now there is a chance again...this time with risc-v. If they manage to port haiku to risc-v on time, they might get more attention and gain more supporters. After Risc-V becomes mainstream (and it has all the opportunities) then the wow effect of haiku running on risc-v , wouldn't be as important. I would completely abandon the ARM port.

[tuxd3v]

Im not sure it would make a difference. Like ARM you would need viable RISC-V hardware for people to get excited about. It is only recently that ARM even became a thing, that is hardware suitable for advance user focused OS’s.

I agree with that..
I see as more important a port to ARM and even for MIPS, than Risc-v at this time..

[cipri]

I agree with that..
I see as more important a port to ARM and even for MIPS, than Risc-v at this time..

I am ordering risc-v hardware exactly right now from seestudio.com , high performance risc-v microcontroller... for an incredible price.
Check out this on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0F4-3X4bet0 it costs 5 Dollar!
Checkout this: https://www.seeedstudio.com/Sipeed-M...oT-p-4046.html

I have programmed many types of microcontrollers... but such a great performance at such price is just incredible!

Alibaba, one of the biggest companies in the world, presented recently a general purpose RISC-V CPU , very powerful.

https://techxplore.com/news/2019-07-alibaba-reveals-processor-based-risc-v.html

China is going into the risc-v direction full-speed ahead.
"Western Digital" (India) is very committed to risc-v, they are shipping billions of components based on risc-v, each year.
Huawei already mentioned that they plan to migrate to risc-v if they continue having that trouble with the arm license.
Quite likely, they already know, that they cannot anymore be dependent on arm.

With Intel and ARM Huawei will have an uncertain future forever.... now they understood that. And I guess not only Huawei understood it, but also other companies, which know have the proof, they the US can anytime create them major troubles even if they dont sell their products directly to the US.

As a response of this big thread, ARM and MIPS and POWER, changed their licenses, but I still don't see any chance for them in the long run.

Check the latest public discussion between Elon Musk and Jack Ma, and you will see how impressed Elon Musk is by the chinese people.
The Tesla Gigafactory 3, in Shanghai was built faster than Elon Musk could imagine. It is the first time Elon Musk is not late on time with this plans!

Now I also like the domain of Math and Theoretical Physics. What do I notice? Many new and great published articles, the authors have chinese-sounding names.
China is a lot more advanced that many can even imagine.
They are hard workers, they deserve it!

cipri

[tuxd3v]

I am ordering risc-v hardware exactly right now from seestudio.com , high performance risc-v microcontroller... for an incredible price.
Check out this on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0F4-3X4bet0 it costs 5 Dollar!
Checkout this: https://www.seeedstudio.com/Sipeed-M...oT-p-4046.html

I have programmed many types of microcontrollers... but such a great performance at such price is just incredible!

Alibaba, one of the biggest companies in the world, presented recently a general purpose RISC-V CPU , very powerful.

https://techxplore.com/news/2019-07-alibaba-reveals-processor-based-risc-v.html

China is going into the risc-v direction full-speed ahead.
"Western Digital" (India) is very committed to risc-v, they are shipping billions of components based on risc-v, each year.
Huawei already mentioned that they plan to migrate to risc-v if they continue having that trouble with the arm license.
Quite likely, they already know, that they cannot anymore be dependent on arm.

With Intel and ARM Huawei will have an uncertain future forever.... now they understood that. And I guess not only Huawei understood it, but also other companies, which know have the proof, they the US can anytime create them major troubles even if they dont sell their products directly to the US.

As a response of this big thread, ARM and MIPS and POWER, changed their licenses, but I still don't see any chance for them in the long run.

Check the latest public discussion between Elon Musk and Jack Ma, and you will see how impressed Elon Musk is by the chinese people.
The Tesla Gigafactory 3, in Shanghai was built faster than Elon Musk could imagine. It is the first time Elon Musk is not late on time with this plans!

Now I also like the domain of Math and Theoretical Physics. What do I notice? Many new and great published articles, the authors have chinese-sounding names.
China is a lot more advanced that many can even imagine.
They are hard workers, they deserve it!

cipri

First of all, let me tel you, that I fully agree with you..
ARM in the long term, is a "poison gift"..

Yes not only Huawei,
Samsung,Xiaomi,Oppo, etc, should also be worried,
Because there are right now a trade War between South of Korea and Japan( Japan own ARM, the rest of Chinese companies should now be very worried with ARM dependency.. ).
So Like China, South Korea is also looking above their shoulders, with that, and any other country that launches successful products on the market..

Yes China is pushing hard, for Risc-V, and they already own the fastest RISC-V cpu out there( by a quite margin..).
I also am playing with Risc-V hardware, but in the field of deep embedded hardware( microcontrolers, and such.. ).

I own this fpga board:
I will play a bit with its e200 32 bits core, and maybe experiment some others there, or maybe( the most probable...finish my 16 bit micro-controller ).
But this hardware, if you look into it, its for deep embedded applications..
they haven't reached yet, the software stacks maturity, nor created the necessary Application processors yet( apart from Alibaba )..

So for now, we are restricted to cpus, and boards with limited capability, or with increased capability, but all programmed in low level languages..
So they haven't reached not half of necessary, to start considering them for full Application stacks, in this regards, ARM and MIPS, are already there..

So,
My comment was in that direction, in the mean time( that RISC-V are maturing.. ), we have ARM and MIPS, ready solutions..
And was based on that, that I said it makes more sense right now for HAiku, to go ARM or MIPS..

In the future, if RISC-V develop its ecosystem hardware/software in a very usable way,
At that time for sure Haiku, will be, or should also be ported to it

[cipri]

And was based on that, that I said it makes more sense right now for HAiku, to go ARM or MIPS..

Ok, here I could agree, if I didn't know the haiku community at all (I wrote some apps for haiku: documentviewer and puri
https://github.com/HaikuArchives/DocumentViewer https://github.com/HaikuArchives/Puri )

Seeing that supporting ARM is quite hard.... my best guess is that haiku will not manage to support more than the RPI board before risc-v will start to take off.
Basically I expect the arm efforts will be mostly just lost man-power. Haiku was always behind the time. When x86-64 was already very established, haiku was only working on 32bit.... I didn't check haiku the last 4-5 years, but I guess not even today the 64bit version is in better shape than the 32bit version.

There is already a lot of buzz around risc-v..... but I think the reality is even vaster! I guess there are a lot of start-ups in the risc-v domain, that will at some point start to pop up like from nowhere.

In fact I think haiku should just drop all the efforts an other platforms...and concentrate just on risc-v... I know it sounds crazy, but if you want to have a chance in the future, you need to take risks.

To mention: Vulkan is also not supported by haiku (not even software renderer)... which again is a pity..., because it was clear since many years that vulkan will be a big thing, and now all android phones starting from Android Q need to support Vulkan 1.1

If you don't have enough man power, at least spend it on something that you expect in the future not to be lost man-power.
Vulkan and RISC-V would be my best guesses.

[tuxd3v]

If you don't have enough man power, at least spend it on something that you expect in the future not to be lost man-power.
Vulkan and RISC-V would be my best guesses.

From that perspective, of low man-power, I agree..
Been the first starting and advancing in something will give you a edge( at least for some time.. ).

And is very well known that China for example don't want a monolithic or Hybrid kernel.. they are thinking in a micro-kernel( HarmonyOS ), that could also improve chances for Haiku..

[cb88]

ARM nor RISC-V will be viable hardware until they share a standard bus... untill then you have to have custom tweaks in drivers and such as well as a separate board support package for each board... they'll remain embedded systems instead of PCs for the forseeable future.

Investing in ARM at the project level would have been and is a complete waste of time... similar to how BeIA was a waste of time. Which is why it has been mostly a volunteer effort by those interested. By the time you get hardware support it's been obsolete for 2-3 years...

With RISC-V there is some small hope that standardization is adopted at least...