Vote On A Distribution For Linux Benchmarking

[LinuxGamer]

Wait..... your confusing me. Do you think I am the one that doesn't think about pages count and the main page must say linux on it? Because that is jrch2k8 who said that. Look back a few pages ago. I was mocking him. Debian also doesn't have linux on its main page, but its about page does. Ubuntu.com is the same way, no linux on the main page, but it is on the about page.

Debian has a Hurd Kernel Linux Kernel and BSD Kernel and a few more Kernels

http://www.debian.org/intro/about

Debian systems currently use the Linux kernel or the FreeBSD kernel. Linux is a piece of software started by Linus Torvalds and supported by thousands of programmers worldwide. FreeBSD is an operating system including a kernel and other software.
However, work is in progress to provide Debian for other kernels, primarily for the Hurd. The Hurd is a collection of servers that run on top of a microkernel (such as Mach) to implement different features. The Hurd is free software produced by the GNU project.

[F.Ultra]

You're not very good at identifying trolls, then. On the pro-Ubuntu side we have verde and Pawlerson. On the anti-Ubuntu side we have LinuxGamer and jrch2k8. Just that the anti-Ubuntu side posts much, much more often.

So ignoring them, of course there are still people who are upset about it. The whole situation with Ubuntu is different than what you mention. Ubuntu has several core pieces of software that is different from the rest of the distributions, as well as the other flops that Canonical has had. X.org and XFree86 are the same X server. GTK and Qt were not used by a single distribution, and at the very start GTK was created as a free alternative to Qt. Same with KDE and GNOME. Inits do not affect the system that much, but Upstart does make Ubuntu look more exclusive. ALSA is a next-generation replacement for OSS, PulseAudio is a framework on top of ALSA (and also a compatibility layer), that's not comparable to the Wayland/Mir split. And Wayland is a next-generation replacement for X.

Well, they might be pro-Ubuntu or whatever but that does not make them trolls.

Saying that Ubuntu have several core pieces that differ is imho far from the truth, even if you as a user use Unity as the desktop environment it's using GTK+ (and is switching over to Qt in future releases), that said they have a few Unity specific API's that they are trying to push out to 3d part developers but I don't know if any one is actually using them besides when Canonical patches other software to use things like the notify bar.

Upstart was once seen as _the_ replacement for init and i.e Red Hat used it in RHEL for some time but then Systemd came along and other distributions switched to it, unfortunatelt it seams that Ubuntu was too far integrated with Upstart by then (compared with Red Hat that didn't have a single Upstart converted init job last time I checked) but perhaps they will also switch to Systemd in the future, atleast that is my hope.

If memory serves me right Unity came when Gnome jumped the shark completely with Gnome3 (which has improved by now but back then Gnome3 was horrible).

Also if memory serves my right Ubuntu had plans to use Wayland as default back in the 10.04 days but when the development of Wayland dragged on these plans where scrapped. Anyways this is not me defending Mir because I would much rather see Ubuntu switch to Wayland when everyone else switches but even if that don't happen it's not the end of the world as the anti-Ubuntu trolls make it out to be.

There is only two things common in a GNU/Linux distribution, #1 the Linux kernel and #2 the GNU userland (and often also glibc, but that is not always the case). Ubuntu have to my knowledge not made any attempt to change any of these.

And have people all of the sudden forgotten the wide veriety that is the software universe of FOSS? We have dozens of different webservers, hundreds of different libraries to handle XML or JSON and so on but all of the sudden a display server makes people behave like religous zealots? Do these people also piss on projects like E17 since it does not use GTK+ or Qt which for some reason is the-one-and-only-allowed-thing?

Do they hate Lighttpd or nginx since Apache is the only blessed and common web server among the distributions (until some of them started to bring in lighttpd and nginx)? Are they burning the distributions that are trying to compile everything with LLVM when GCC is the defacto FOSS standard of all time??? And what about the distributions that replace glibc with uclibc (holy cow they replaced a big central part of GNU!!!).

[F.Ultra]

hmm main page http://www.opensuse.org/en/

"openSUSE is a free and Linux-based operating system for your PC, Laptop or Server. You can surf the web, manage your e-mails and photos, do office work, play videos or music and have a lot of fun!"

Irony must not be strong with you, young padawan.

[dh04000]

Debian has a Hurd Kernel Linux Kernel and BSD Kernel and a few more Kernels

http://www.debian.org/intro/about

Debian systems currently use the Linux kernel or the FreeBSD kernel. Linux is a piece of software started by Linus Torvalds and supported by thousands of programmers worldwide. FreeBSD is an operating system including a kernel and other software.
However, work is in progress to provide Debian for other kernels, primarily for the Hurd. The Hurd is a collection of servers that run on top of a microkernel (such as Mach) to implement different features. The Hurd is free software produced by the GNU project.

I'm.... I'm not sure what your point is, so I'm going to have to ignore you. I'm not sure what your saying and you didn't seem to have read my previous posts.... so...... yeah....... don't respond to this. I'm not going to respond to you anymore either.

[LinuxGamer]

Well, they might be pro-Ubuntu or whatever but that does not make them trolls.

Saying that Ubuntu have several core pieces that differ is imho far from the truth, even if you as a user use Unity as the desktop environment it's using GTK+ (and is switching over to Qt in future releases), that said they have a few Unity specific API's that they are trying to push out to 3d part developers but I don't know if any one is actually using them besides when Canonical patches other software to use things like the notify bar.

Upstart was once seen as _the_ replacement for init and i.e Red Hat used it in RHEL for some time but then Systemd came along and other distributions switched to it, unfortunatelt it seams that Ubuntu was too far integrated with Upstart by then (compared with Red Hat that didn't have a single Upstart converted init job last time I checked) but perhaps they will also switch to Systemd in the future, atleast that is my hope.

If memory serves me right Unity came when Gnome jumped the shark completely with Gnome3 (which has improved by now but back then Gnome3 was horrible).

Also if memory serves my right Ubuntu had plans to use Wayland as default back in the 10.04 days but when the development of Wayland dragged on these plans where scrapped. Anyways this is not me defending Mir because I would much rather see Ubuntu switch to Wayland when everyone else switches but even if that don't happen it's not the end of the world as the anti-Ubuntu trolls make it out to be.

There is only two things common in a GNU/Linux distribution, #1 the Linux kernel and #2 the GNU userland (and often also glibc, but that is not always the case). Ubuntu have to my knowledge not made any attempt to change any of these.

And have people all of the sudden forgotten the wide veriety that is the software universe of FOSS? We have dozens of different webservers, hundreds of different libraries to handle XML or JSON and so on but all of the sudden a display server makes people behave like religous zealots? Do these people also piss on projects like E17 since it does not use GTK+ or Qt which for some reason is the-one-and-only-allowed-thing?

Do they hate Lighttpd or nginx since Apache is the only blessed and common web server among the distributions (until some of them started to bring in lighttpd and nginx)? Are they burning the distributions that are trying to compile everything with LLVM when GCC is the defacto FOSS standard of all time??? And what about the distributions that replace glibc with uclibc (holy cow they replaced a big central part of GNU!!!).

long as they don't f*** up are low-level graphics stack ohh wait Mir is...

[LinuxGamer]

I'm.... I'm not sure what your point is, so I'm going to have to ignore you. I'm not sure what your saying and you didn't seem to have read my previous posts.... so...... yeah....... don't respond to this. I'm not going to respond to you anymore either.

Debian is not Linux Only..

[dh04000]

I love how there is now 5 people railing on jrch2k8. And he still won't give up, he just ignores anything that tangibly proves him wrong.

Hows main page vs about page for debian and redhat treat ya jrch2k8? Lol. Debian and Redhat must really piss you off because they don't mention linux on the front page.

[grenadecx]

Well, they might be pro-Ubuntu or whatever but that does not make them trolls.

Saying that Ubuntu have several core pieces that differ is imho far from the truth, even if you as a user use Unity as the desktop environment it's using GTK+ (and is switching over to Qt in future releases), that said they have a few Unity specific API's that they are trying to push out to 3d part developers but I don't know if any one is actually using them besides when Canonical patches other software to use things like the notify bar.

Upstart was once seen as _the_ replacement for init and i.e Red Hat used it in RHEL for some time but then Systemd came along and other distributions switched to it, unfortunatelt it seams that Ubuntu was too far integrated with Upstart by then (compared with Red Hat that didn't have a single Upstart converted init job last time I checked) but perhaps they will also switch to Systemd in the future, atleast that is my hope.

If memory serves me right Unity came when Gnome jumped the shark completely with Gnome3 (which has improved by now but back then Gnome3 was horrible).

Also if memory serves my right Ubuntu had plans to use Wayland as default back in the 10.04 days but when the development of Wayland dragged on these plans where scrapped. Anyways this is not me defending Mir because I would much rather see Ubuntu switch to Wayland when everyone else switches but even if that don't happen it's not the end of the world as the anti-Ubuntu trolls make it out to be.

There is only two things common in a GNU/Linux distribution, #1 the Linux kernel and #2 the GNU userland (and often also glibc, but that is not always the case). Ubuntu have to my knowledge not made any attempt to change any of these.

And have people all of the sudden forgotten the wide veriety that is the software universe of FOSS? We have dozens of different webservers, hundreds of different libraries to handle XML or JSON and so on but all of the sudden a display server makes people behave like religous zealots? Do these people also piss on projects like E17 since it does not use GTK+ or Qt which for some reason is the-one-and-only-allowed-thing?

Do they hate Lighttpd or nginx since Apache is the only blessed and common web server among the distributions (until some of them started to bring in lighttpd and nginx)? Are they burning the distributions that are trying to compile everything with LLVM when GCC is the defacto FOSS standard of all time??? And what about the distributions that replace glibc with uclibc (holy cow they replaced a big central part of GNU!!!).

Couldn't have said it better, thank you.

[TheBlackCat]

Also if memory serves my right Ubuntu had plans to use Wayland as default back in the 10.04 days but when the development of Wayland dragged on these plans where scrapped. Anyways this is not me defending Mir because I would much rather see Ubuntu switch to Wayland when everyone else switches but even if that don't happen it's not the end of the world as the anti-Ubuntu trolls make it out to be.

I agree with everything else you said, but not this. For one thing, if they had used their development resources to help with Wayland instead of starting over from scratch, then it would have progressed faster. Second, the slow pace of development was not one of initial reasons listed for using Mir (the initial reasons were all false or irrelevant), nor have I heard any later mention of this issue by Mir devs, this seems to be a reason entirely or almost entirely invented by fans not involved in the development of either Mir or Wayland. Third, the API-stable (and nearly fully-functional) 1.0 release of Wayland was 5 months before Mir was even announced.

[jrch2k8]

Doing reguarly. Most of the patches are from Debian Unstable.

Maybe you didn't know that RHEL6 uses Upstart as its Init-System.

Did you even read the linked article? The "D" in "Dash" stands for "Debian". Debian has used "Dash" for years and Ubuntu only followed Debian.

Providing code isn't the only way to improve Linux in general. And there is absoletely no

Samba4 is also broken in Debian.

Your problem is that you want to hate Ubuntu and Canonical and you are trying to find "facts" to prove that your hate is right. If Ubuntu and Canonical wouldn't exist, you would possibly focus your hate on another distribution, company or project (Maybe RedHat because they are making money from selling Linux?).

0.) i did know that, i never said wasn't good [for the time RHEL got frozen at least] the point is time passed did its job and its replacement is here and everyone is moving to it to help minimize fragmentation and provide many missing features but again ubuntu will stay with it for no reason, i mean can't you give it a try as optional package and retrofit your doubts as everyone else do, so it can get better? and make everybody life easier

1.) yeap is true but in this case i refer to those problematic signed @canonical.com that has made freedesktop bugzilla explode from time to time and other packages like ubuntu specific many KDE bugs, etc mesa is an example, sure it won't happen every release but is frequent enough to be remembered over other distros boo boo

2.) true but is true too that sometimes they differ too in certain releases, i have met cases where script worked in debian unstable/sid and not in ubuntu then some update came and worked in in both and so on <-- this is what i mean by annoying

3.) well publicity can be considered help sure bring users can be considered sure but FOSS is not an free cheap windows/mac is an idea of how openness and related can improve your experience, security, knowledge and trust of the tools you use, simply make PR for ubuntu and bring some users not sure if helps the concept

4.) most be fixed minutes later cuz i have 6 servers running samba + fsplugins in debian unstable integrated with another AD (2008r2 / samba4 gentoo) + openAFS cells integration and the client with ubuntu server i got it fixed manually dpkging the debian unstable package.

there is no problem in make money with linux at all and redhat is a very active focused contributor in every sense with respect for the community and for enterprise clients i love it since the support is superB

my issue with canonical is not blind hate is their love for doings thing the apple way, i mean see it my way

a.) Mir, for non technical reason at all create a problem that shoudn't exist and in the future could be worse since certain paths could fail in one backend and not others since they have some similarities but are different enough at the same time to create some debug hell later[assuming for X reason you are forced to provide compatibility for both]

b.) Unity is not a problem on itself since is just another DE but couldn't they use more commons technologies to avoid specific APIs? there are way to handle menus outside apps that can be used by every toolkit even selectable in runtime <-- maybe this could change in unity 8

c.) upstart was better ish that most init systems replacements some time ago[2 or 3 years ago] i give you that but is not smarter to once systemd started get features go and integrate yourself and discuss/propose/improve instead of again be the odd men out without provide any technical reason?. Sure a lot of ppl seems to hate lennart for no reason but systemd today is quite impressive already [sure many edges can still be polished and some changes maybe are scary for some ppl but once you get used to it is a hell of an improvement specially in resource control/debug/speed/easyness/virtualization and security]

If canonical just stop creating problem from thin air and integrate properly with everyone else we could achieve some standardization in key part of the OS that will help everyone