Systemd-Free, XBPS-Powered Void Linux Releases New Images

[Vistaus]

The only thing I don't like about Void is that xbps is quite cumbersome to write. Yes, I know you can set up abbreviations to change it, but I still think they should come up with an easier-to-write thing.

[cynical]

But I like choice. I think it's bad for the tech ecosystem when a single product dominates the market. Single web browser, single init system, single kernel, single programming language, anything. Even if that product is a fantastic product, like Chromium, systemd, Linux, and Javascript (ha! yes, that was a joke). So while I support systemd, I also support runit and GNU Shepherd.

Me too. I never thought the 'wasted resources' argument was worth anything. People are not little cogs you can just move from here to there. If someone has insight into a different way of doing things and feels motivated enough to try, then I think it's great that they go and pursue it. That experimentation is where progress comes from. If the result is a failure, that's fine, you still learn from it. (JavaScript is great though, seriously)

[Michael_S]

People are not little cogs you can just move from here to there. If someone has insight into a different way of doing things and feels motivated enough to try, then I think it's great that they go and pursue it. That experimentation is where progress comes from. If the result is a failure, that's fine, you still learn from it. (JavaScript is great though, seriously)

And just as importantly, I don't have the right to demand that someone else work on the open source projects that I prefer. I can try to persuade systemd developers to work on something else, I can try to persuade systemd users to use something else, I can use something else, and I can contribute to the alternative. But entirely too much of the rage around disliked tech projects seems to come from the mindset, "Dammit, you should be building what I want right now, and I hate you for believing you have the right to choose differently!"

[jrch2k8]

Void had to drop systemd due to the latter's lack of support for musl. The same applies to Alpine.

This is the only real issue i agree systemd have but technically speaking, Musl should be the one to code many of those missing bits too, so i would say is 50/50 in this case.

Sure some of the missing bits maybe very very GNU'ish but also some other specially related to scandirat and apparmor/syscalls are kinda essential to be inside a libc otherwise every project would have to implement their own equivalent and this could become a massive clusterfuck of security issues which is the point of many if not all systemd developers, so is not like they are doing cuz "lennart hate them" or anything but for actual very technical reasons, so i cannot complain too much about it

[kaprikawn]

I would've thought the anti-systemd crazies would have been all over this thread, where are they? I don't know anything about Void, but just reading the article, this sounds like a much better choice than something like the clusterfudge that is Devuan.

[tildearrow]

IMHO all these anti systemd stuff is useless... Systemd actually makes things easier by providing easy to use standard tools to administer the system that will be always available, for instance, with timedatectl you get nice easy to use NTP or hostnamectl, journalctl, etc... which makes it easier. Also systemd unit files are much better than writing custom shell scripts for startup. Every time the Linux ecosystem gets something good a lot of people resist it. Maybe they are been paid by companies who want Linux to stay fragmented making its grow slower on the desktop, ... Who knows...

My only problem with systemd is that it closes SSH sessions immediately after typing "sudo poweroff" or "sudo reboot". I'm not sure whether this can be worked around, and a quick search for "systemd poweroff closes ssh sessions immediately" returns unrelated stuff because DuckDuckGo doesn't know how to read.

The rest (resolved, non-linger and the 90-second wait) can be worked around.

Oh wait, one more thing. Can I customize the boot colors and messages? (without editing the source)

[bnolsen]

good to see. linux 4.12 is old, I hope they added rfkill to the images etc. I'll take my built up system that boots from grub in 8s over some trashy ubuntu systemd thing that takes a minute and a half to do the same.

[lowflyer]

I would've thought the anti-systemd crazies would have been all over this thread, where are they? I don't know anything about Void, but just reading the article, this sounds like a much better choice than something like the clusterfudge that is Devuan.

They do not exist. You are hunting a ghost.

[Guest]

IMHO all these anti systemd stuff is useless... Systemd actually makes things easier by providing easy to use standard tools to administer the system that will be always available, for instance, with timedatectl you get nice easy to use NTP or hostnamectl, journalctl, etc... which makes it easier. Also systemd unit files are much better than writing custom shell scripts for startup. Every time the Linux ecosystem gets something good a lot of people resist it. Maybe they are been paid by companies who want Linux to stay fragmented making its grow slower on the desktop, ... Who knows...

Systemd is dangerously buggy, I dont care how fast my PC starts up inasmuch it can freeze my PC for "nothing".

[tenspd137]

Gentoo, OpenRC. Easy to use, fkexible, text based logfiles. Nuff said.