Linux 4.14-rc7 No Longer Clashes With AppArmor To Break Networking

[L_A_G]

I see Linus is being his usual self and sending angry emails laden with profanity whenever devs make a mess in mainline and refuse to fix the mess they made or push that mess to mainline so late into a kernel cycle it can't be properly fixed before the end of the cycle.

If I was in his position I'd probably express myself with less profanity and focus more on simply questioning the competency of the maintainer who dumped this problem on me.

Still, using profanity is a rather effective way to express your frustration with something/someone and here in Finland we do have the saying "Tapoja on moni - Sano mummo kun kissalla pöytää pyyhki". The saying translates to English roughly as "There's always may ways to do something - Said grandma as she used the cat to scrub the table".

Yes, that saying really does talk about an old lady using a cat as a table rag.

[xeekei]

It's good that it was reverted. I agree with the rule of never breaking userspace. But I don't like the cult of personality around Linus. He's not a god.

[FireBurn]

Right action, wrong means. Swearing didn't add anything to the impact of that message

[stormcrow]

It's good that it was reverted. I agree with the rule of never breaking userspace. But I don't like the cult of personality around Linus. He's not a god.

Depends on how you define "god". If you mean the ultimate arbiter of a society and/or creation, then Linus is a god. Let me explain what I mean before people jump down my throat. First of all, I'm being humorous. Next from a technical point of view Linus is the ultimate authority on what goes in his Linux kernel code tree. That code tree is the standard from which all other Linux code trees share ancestry and defines, more or less, "what is Linux". Now from a legal point of view "Linux" is a legal trademark for the Linux kernel and it's owned by Linus. So from both the technical and legal points, he IS the Linux god.

[zakhrov]

Well I do hope nothing like this happens to the AMDGPU DC pull request for 4.15

[sdack]

As always, harsh but true words by Linus.
Let's hope the AppArmor maintainers understood it.

I don't even think it's true. Newer kernels almost always break something. This isn't just another patch level. It's a new minor kernel version.

Rather Linus does as he pleases. I have yet to see Linus go mad when a new kernel breaks the proprietary Nvidia driver, which it has done many times in the past and it will continue to do so in the future even when a lot of people rely on these.

So how does one get a change into a new kernel, which breaks with old software? Obviously it's all a regression now ...

[zakhrov]

I have yet to see Linus go mad when a new kernel breaks the proprietary Nvidia driver, which it has done many times in the past and it will continue to do so in the future even when a lot of people rely on these.

Thats because it is a proprietary driver that overwrites parts of the kernel with its own voodoo and it expects the kernel to work in the same way. Whenever the kernel is updated, Nvidia needs to work around it so their secret sauce still works with the new kernel

[starshipeleven]

I don't even think it's true. Newer kernels almost always break something. This isn't just another patch level. It's a new minor kernel version.

You mean hardware support? because Torvalds is talking of userspace interface.

Rather Linus does as he pleases. I have yet to see Linus go mad when a new kernel breaks the proprietary Nvidia driver

Rather you have no fucking clue, as NVIDIA's driver is a driver (no duh) and as all drivers it is relying on Linux kernel driver ABI that is not stable.

So how does one get a change into a new kernel, which breaks with old software? Obviously it's all a regression now ...

Already explained above, versioned API. It's reasonable to assume that people contributing to an OS kernel know the basic stuff.

[sdack]

Thats because it is a proprietary driver that overwrites parts of the kernel with its own voodoo and it expects the kernel to work in the same way. Whenever the kernel is updated, Nvidia needs to work around it so their secret sauce still works with the new kernel

I'm not saying a new kernel shouldn't or couldn't break older software. It has always done so. But I agree with the notion of it being a proprietary driver thing. Linus hates Nvidia. Hence I say he does as he pleases. He always has.

[sdack]

Rather you have no fucking clue ...

No, you don't have a clue. You're just licking the spit of one ill-mannered dev as if it would grant you his powers. You're an idiot as always.