Today Marks 30 Years Since The Release Of X11

[timofonic]

30 years old and still 100% bug-free.

Are you sarcastic? I think so!

Nothing is bug-free. If bugs aren't found, something is done in extremely very wrong ways. Design is a good start, but iterative processes adapt and improve a lot better if are correctly managed. It isn't something new at all, it comes from biology

About Wayland vs XOrg/X11: Adapt or die! Don't depend on legacy crap. If software is fossilizied and gets bitrot, let it die and make better and more modern alternatives. Anyone remembers about OpenVMS and Solaris these days?

[Guest]

The "let it die and make better and modern alternatives" approach only works if you have thousands and thousands of developers working and reviewing each other's work.
Free software doesn't have that and so timing is the issue. "Legacy crap" has to stay while alternatives are written.
Luckily it is not from scratch since GTK3/Qt5 already support Wayland but you will still be regressing a lot if Qt6/GTK4 removed X11 support.
Developers are obviously doing their bests but there is simply not enough manpower in the open source world to just migrate everything this year away from X11.

[Duve]

Developers are obviously doing their bests but there is simply not enough manpower in the open source world to just migrate everything this year away from X11.

Even if you were developing in something closed such as Windows, changing the display stack is non-trivial.... users will notice issues almost immediately since it is something that the user always interacts with.
And this is something that Mircosoft has tired before, it can get rather painful (Vista was something of a sea change on the display stack, they have been modifying it since). I don't think that there is anyone in software today that would have the manpower for something so critical without a yearly-staged plan. Given that, Wayland has been moving rather swift but again that has been something that has been planed for all over the stack.

[leipero]

Yes, that's because of really extremely very low quality standards in that regard :P

XOrg/X11? Please make a fast assassination plan ASAP! Or well, it would be more of an assisted suicide or euthanasia

Well, I would say X11 is better than any other window system, inclding Windows one, regardless of how old it is, so if standards are low right now, they are not set by X11 . Ofc., that's just my opinion, without any technical look, even if someone could make a good case of why windows system is better, the very fact that X is so configurable (and open source) puts it ahead, and sure I understand that lot's of it's configurability relies on other components that work with X, but still if that was another system, those components probably wouldn't be as configurable to begin with.

[Azrael5]

Today also DOS still works good

[aufkrawall]

Funny thing is, X11 is 30 years old and still the best window system available (in general, not talking about open source only).

Since you can't have X11 without Xorg server, this seems a very hypothetical way to look at things to me.

[Guest]

Today also DOS still works good

There are still construction materials laboratory machines running DOS.

[duby229]

Had it not been for the license change that caused a huge uproar, XFree86 would of probably still been the dominate X implementation.

That's doubtful. The dude spent most of his time developing IPV6 support for it. What a total waste of effort that was.

[timofonic]

X12 would have been a good thing. It was meant to give us the graphics capabilities of Wayland while maintaining the xlib framework.

Wayland bridges the gap between Linux/X11 and macOS. Try using macOS for a while.
But current Linux desktops are simply not ready for Wayland.

X11 needs to stay for at least another 7 or 8 years while things are ready for Wayland. It would be a disaster if X11 disappeared today.

Don't jump ahead too much. Wayland is better but X11 is more forgiving for current compositors.

The morale of the story is that once the Linux desktop is ready for Wayland, we will be on par with macOS and Android.

In what sense? In certain way, Linux desktop is very superior to all others. And this is a miracle most of the time, because lots of NIH and monocultures such as GNOME and the puppet competitor KDE (it reminds me of Microsoft and Apple).

The only way to make it happen is by doing it. Time doesn't matter, but actions.

[Guest]

In what sense? In certain way, Linux desktop is very superior to all others. And this is a miracle most of the time, because lots of NIH and monocultures such as GNOME and the puppet competitor KDE (it reminds me of Microsoft and Apple).

The only way to make it happen is by doing it. Time doesn't matter, but actions.

Have you used macOS before? Literally none of the lag or jitter you get with X11 compositors. Pretty much everything follows the desktop theme correctly. Very fluid animations even with integrated intel graphics. Everything is pixel perfect. A large portion of this is what Wayland is supposed to offer, correct?
Apart from the initial memory allocations, base memory usage somewhat static and you desktop remains responsive after a whole week.

The only way to make it happen is by doing it. Time doesn't matter, but actions.

Look, don't turn this into a argument. Go try different operating systems yourself and give your own review.