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It Looks Like AMDGPU DC (DAL) Will Not Be Accepted In The Linux Kernel

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  • #21
    Originally posted by Ouroboros View Post
    Well, I guess I'll be manually patching and building the kernel for DAL/DC instead of waiting. Hopefully they make the patches easily accessible assuming they haven't already.

    I don't really like Airlie's attitude throughout the reply, but he makes good points in the last paragraph. Expecting perfection and for them to perfectly conform his standards and maintain it separately which is exactly what they're trying to avoid is a bit unreasonable, though that's the feeling I get from it.

    It'd be nice if they could properly discuss what their options are, where they can compromise, and what they have planned for the future if it's merged. Again, this is assuming they haven't already; I haven't been following it. The 'My way or the highway' response doesn't help anyone when they know it's not possible.
    I don't think you understand what the drm folks are complaining about.
    BOTH airlie and vetter had the same issue with this latest rfc. The difference is that airlie wasn't being circumspect.
    Take a look at the ml and read through the very brief thread (six or seven missives, I behave).
    Maybe bridgman is aware of something that's not apparent to me, but the fact that agdf said (AIUI) that the hal had to stay because otherwise they just don't have the resources to do validation as well, means that the most we can hope for, in the near future, is an Android-type situation. Over time the delta will get smaller (assuming they work to improve the drm abstractions do they more closely resemble what AMD needs from them) but that core HAL may not go away for awhile.
    Of course, it's still very early days. Maybe this really is a miscommunication. Maybe they can work on their validation "framework" as they diverge from the HAL?


    ​​​​​​@Qaridarium
    Take a page from bridgman and try to be classy. You can get the same info across without causing misery.
    Last edited by liam; 12-08-2016, 10:52 PM.

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    • #22
      Before this communist coded vulkan, he was removing DAL code and creating bugs to it. Redhat is bad for the Linux community, in Debian we suffer from gnome3, pulseaudio and now this. This communist is a beginner when not figuring out why abstraction layer is needed for shared code.

      Nouveau developers can do everything they want, there is even assembler in the code. Nouveau is useless bloatware and this communist does not attack against it while he should attack.
      Last edited by debianxfce; 12-08-2016, 10:58 PM.

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      • #23
        Originally posted by shmerl View Post

        There easily can be poor quality FOSS code. Just because it's FOSS doesn't make it good quality. Anyway, above comment wasn't constructive.
        so your theory of bad FOSS code in reality: YOUR SHIT CODE IS NOT ACCEPTED TO THE KERNEL...

        end of story no more shit code... and THIS IS CONSTRUCTIVE
        Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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        • #24
          This is really sad. Ever since I've learned about the work AMD is putting to create an amazing driver the way it should be made (and the progress of it over this year) more and more I've shared the feeling of many: I'll get an AMD card/my next card will be AMD (vega).

          I hope that what's happening here is just a temporary setback and a communication problem. Also, thanks for all you've done so far bridgman. Hopefully we'll find a reasonable option/solution for this problem soon.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post

            so your theory of bad FOSS code in reality: YOUR SHIT CODE IS NOT ACCEPTED TO THE KERNEL...

            end of story no more shit code... and THIS IS CONSTRUCTIVE

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            • #26
              Originally posted by liam View Post
              ​​​​​​@Qaridarium
              Take a page from bridgman and try to be classy. You can get the same info across without causing misery.
              In technical aspects political correctness is BULLSHIT!
              and to be a Social justice warrior in a technical forum is really nonsense.
              Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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              • #27
                bridgman There definitely is a disconnect. Reading your posts, Harry's and Dave's messages I have an impression that you and Harry have and still are severely underestimating the amount of pushback there is against an effective extra abstraction layer between HAL and DRM. Anything that is more than a very thin HAL to a standardized common interface got a hard no.

                DC seems to be a common HAL for Linux and Windows + OS specific abstraction layer wiring it into DRM and what Dave keeps telling you is that is the opposite of what is acceptable. He even provides your with an example why: it's mac80211 all over again.

                My recommendation: get on Skype, Google Hangout or whatever. Something that gives both "sides" more ques than email, because clearly the disconnect is huge.

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post

                  In technical aspects political correctness is BULLSHIT!
                  and to be a Social justice warrior in a technical forum is really nonsense.
                  It's not political correctness. It's called not being a complete asshole just because you can. You can get the same message across in a more mannered tone. It would be more effective since people are more willing to read something that isn't completely aggressive and near insulting which has no reason for being what it is.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by Qaridarium View Post

                    In technical aspects political correctness is BULLSHIT!
                    and to be a Social justice warrior in a technical forum is really nonsense.
                    Well, I very nearly just double posted what computerquip said, so, I'll skip that part.
                    .....
                    ......
                    OK! Here's the rule: if you wouldn't talk to your (priest|parent|prof|$authorityFigureYouRespect) that way then you shouldn't say it to the with whom you're speaking. Obviously this rule can be ignored it the other party isn't being respectful to you.
                    BTW, why do you think bridgman can decide AMD internal resource allocation and project direction? What evidence do you have that bridgman made these decisions?

                    Edit:

                    c2h5oh
                    You make an excellent suggestion! Why kernel folks are so unwilling to deviate from ml when there are better tools (yes, I read the recent lwn article, and no, it didn't make much of a case, imho) I really don't understand.
                    15min of the right folks over hangouts (very popular in enterprise, interestingly) would get a lot of this worked out, one way or the other.
                    Last edited by liam; 12-08-2016, 11:24 PM.

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                    • #30
                      I was really looking forward to see these features arriving in the Kernel. And I do agree with AMD - in an economical or practical perspective sharing code is very important and it's OK to try it. Not having these features in the Kernel soon would even be a little desaster for several parties like Valve etc.
                      But Airlie is absolutely right. We already have these drivers that only work with firmware blobs breaking installation media of distributions not shipping them by default. That's a compromise to get hardware accelerated graphics working. (While I think that there has definitely something to be done to make AMDGPU working rudimentarily without firmware, though not necessarily fast enough to play games).
                      But the Linux Kernel is the most important software project in the world. If it breaks it would lead to a world crisis. There are quality borders that are more important than the development budget of AMD. It's that simple and we will all have to live with it for our own good. Even if it means in the worst case that FreeSync will always be an exclusive AMDGPU-PRO feature. And even if it sounds rude but it's simply consistent.

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