Ubuntu's Desktop-Next Switching From .DEBs To Snappy

[blackout23]

True, but what about installing a program offline (like is possible on windows)? any program always require to install a bunch of (online) dependencies. I hope that this ubuntu initiative will fix that.

Windows applications have dependencies, too. Ever had an installer that pulled .NET runtimes? I don't see how requiring an internet connection is a problem these days. If you want to install a package offline, where did you get it from? A floppy disk? No the internet. Might as well use that to pull the deps.

[schmidtbag]

Though we REALLY don't need yet-another-package-manager, I don't think it really matter that Canonical is doing this as long as Ubuntu retains some .deb support by default. If they don't allow deb packages to be updated with everything else, that could really piss people off. To me, my only gripe with the debian package manager is it's very slow and it doesn't handle broken packages very well. Other than that, I think it's great.

I think my greatest problem with Canonical doing this is like everything they do, they just simply do it "because they can" and have no interest in contributing toward the community. They could have developed toward wayland, but instead made mir. They could have contributed toward gnome, but instead made unity. They could have contributed toward systemd, but instead made upstart. And now this. There just doesn't appear to be any solid reasoning behind their decisions. It's not that what they create is bad, it's just not necessary.

[A-Singh]

https://github.com/mikix/deb2snap

[vitalif]

I don't get why people are complaining. They are moving away from traditional packages to something docker like, the same way Red Hat is doing with project Atomic. The current package systems are broken, and initiatives like Snapy, Atomic and Nixos are the future.

O_o package managers are the most convenient thing in current Linux distros. All these new "alternatives" are just the copy of the old idiotic Windoze-like approach which may only be useful for distributing closed-source applications. And closed-source applications are NOT the thing that I want to see in my Linux system. Closed-source Linux is not Linux anymore, it's just another Android, and I would never like to see Android on my desktop.

That's why using the "alternative" for the whole system is very bad idea.

By the way, I've never advised anyone to use Ubuntu - just use Debian and be happy.

[GreatEmerald]

I think my greatest problem with Canonical doing this is like everything they do, they just simply do it "because they can" and have no interest in contributing toward the community. They could have developed toward wayland, but instead made mir. They could have contributed toward gnome, but instead made unity. They could have contributed toward systemd, but instead made upstart. And now this. There just doesn't appear to be any solid reasoning behind their decisions. It's not that what they create is bad, it's just not necessary.

While I agree with the sentiment, you're wrong about systemd there. It was made in part due to Upstart's CLA.

[moilami]

Though we REALLY don't need yet-another-package-manager, I don't think it really matter that Canonical is doing this as long as Ubuntu retains some .deb support by default. If they don't allow deb packages to be updated with everything else, that could really piss people off. To me, my only gripe with the debian package manager is it's very slow and it doesn't handle broken packages very well. Other than that, I think it's great.

I think my greatest problem with Canonical doing this is like everything they do, they just simply do it "because they can" and have no interest in contributing toward the community. They could have developed toward wayland, but instead made mir. They could have contributed toward gnome, but instead made unity. They could have contributed toward systemd, but instead made upstart. And now this. There just doesn't appear to be any solid reasoning behind their decisions. It's not that what they create is bad, it's just not necessary.

There is this minor issue about third party *debs made for Ubuntu will not work in Debian as easily anymore, at least untill someone makes a Snappy to Deb converter. I am not saying Ubuntu is evil when they try to make faster softaware management.

[Luke]

Not all systems are networked.

Windows applications have dependencies, too. Ever had an installer that pulled .NET runtimes? I don't see how requiring an internet connection is a problem these days. If you want to install a package offline, where did you get it from? A floppy disk? No the internet. Might as well use that to pull the deps.

There are lots of machines used offline for which another, portable machine collects updates remotely. This is common when a desktop at home is used for media by someone who does not have a home Internet connection. that was me until just a few years ago.

Now I have the opposite to deal with as well-custom packages that exist only locally, meaning copies must be kept (including known good rollbacks) on all machines I administer elsewhere that use them. Those travel on flash drives, not over the network

[vitalif]

To me, my only gripe with the debian package manager is it's very slow and it doesn't handle broken packages very well. Other than that, I think it's great.

Hm... It's slow compared to what? What operation takes a long time in your case? "Reading package lists..." or something else?

[moilami]

Hm... It's slow compared to what? What operation takes a long time in your case? "Reading package lists..." or something else?

Everything takes ages and makes me long for Pacman each time

[lkundrak]

I don't get why people are complaining. They are moving away from traditional packages to something docker like, the same way Red Hat is doing with project Atomic. The current package systems are broken, and initiatives like Snapy, Atomic and Nixos are the future.

Note that Atomic host is based on ostree-rpm, which, obviously, uses RPMs to build the trees. The containers are also build from RPMs. Various technologies to ship the bits are merely complementary to RPM; they have to be built somehow and RPM does the job rather well.