R.I.P. Steve Jobs

[PsynoKhi0]

Except that I never said anything about nazis. Although it is true that the nazi party was the power behind one of germany many eras of dictatorship.

I'll make a new made up law that states that as conversations on the internet progress the likelyhood of someone mentioning a made up law in an attempt to discredit someone goes up exponentially. I think I'll call it "Duby's Law"

Neither did I say the probability had already reached 1... Only pointing out how many uncalled-for comments started popping up here. Given the reaction though, I guess I've had my last shot and will now do what I should apparently have done from the moment things started heading south: ignore that thread. Have fun.

[duby229]

I think you do not realize that the Nazis just exploit as slave the German inventor and scientist.

For example the inventor of the computer "Zuse" Conrad Zuse only work for the nazis as a scientist because he do not want go in the war as a soldier.

the US better won the war in 1945 because maybe A few years later they fight against computer driven cyborg robots. (this sentence is a joke)



Sure but democracy is an European discovery the "F?r?er" discovery it 1500 years ago. the European also do have the oldest still working parliament 1300 years old.

Any yes i give the us people credit for there FED-credit-Money system with that system they can build many slave nations. ;-) (this sentence is not a joke)

and yes Democracy is great i love it

Lets give credit where credit is due.... Democracy was first invented by the Helenistic Greeks thousands of years ago.

Your delusional about slave nations... The Soviet Union had slave nations, of which North Germany was one of them... Personally I'm proud of capitalism, it is the only form of commerce that works. Socialism has been the direct cause of collapse of every major society going all the way back to the Egyptian Empire.. I mean really how many times does an ideology have to fail before people realize that it does not work.

If nobody earns their own way, and everybody wants a free ride, then the system will fail.... TANSTAAFL

[Panix]

Germany is practically a fascist country. Way too many restrictions on freedoms that are treated as illegal. The German politicians aren't dictators? Um, forcing the EU on other countries?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgNakvL728A

Merkel et el. (CDU, SPD, Greens etc., virtually all mainstream parties in Germany) are shills for these elites and bankers.

The U.S. is on their way to becoming a police state also, as well as other countries.

Obviously, democracy doesn't work. You have to be informed, have some common sense and value thinking.

[jcgeny]

the topic is going very far away from steve jobs , may be because there are not so many jobs on the market....
for the rest like evilness of germans .... some better had learned at school that nazism came with big powerty in germany .
a lot of europeans jews were killed during ww2 but a lot of them went in the usa with a lot of money.....
66 years after the end of ww2 , at that time the usa was the bank of the world , the usa is one of of the weakest economy and democracy of the world . its job is only to defend usrahell at "all cost"

usrahell is well described by pacifists http://palsolidarity.org/ and everyday life there is , for no-jews , like http://french.irib.ir/component/k2/i...renvers%C3%A9e

while south of the usa and more and more of it , is burning at the hardest level ...

http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/

it started in the texas : the land where live gwbush , the man of the no-inside-job-9-11-2001 and of the NO-CLIMATE-CHANGE . the second being for sure THE next : " NAZISM "

[sonnet]

Sure I'll give the nazis credit for their technical prowess. Its a fact that the nazi germans pioneered many of the technologies that we take for granted today. But it doesnt mean that they werent evil. Also you can thank the US for your democracy. People around the world refuse to admit it, but we ARE good at nation building.

You can't be serious.

US government is even worse than Nazis. At least Nazis were clear about the fact that it was a dictatorship and their purposes. With them, you knew clearly who to fight, they didn't hide behind the curtains. US government it's the worse, he goes all around the globe (thanks to its ignorant citizens like you)
stealing resources from other nations with the excuse that they want to export their "democracy".

But Chile had their democratically elected president Allende, whose guilt was to not make the interests of the US corporations, so US democratic government killed him and installed their puppet Dictator

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salvador_Allende

And what about Enrico Mattei? He was Italian public administrator responsible for the ENI . He was guilt because he:
negotiated important oil concessions in the Middle East as well as a significant trade agreement with the Soviet Union which helped break the oligopoly of the 'Seven Sisters' that dominated the mid 20th century oil industry. He also introduced the principle whereby the country that owned exploited oil reserves received 75% of the profits.[1]
And that was a bad thing for the US democracy..so they killed him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enrico_Mattei

Or all the intervention in Central America?

http://www.zompist.com/latam.html

Try to be less ignorant and less affected by your national propaganda

[Panix]

We should probably go back to the topic of Steve Jobs (if contributing to this thread)?

I don't understand the overwhelming response and praise for Jobs especially the technology crowd. There was marketing and yes, innovation, etc., but with closed source and a substantial cost for that use!

Also, it is especially remarkable the praise has been given from Linux users. Is there not hypocrisy here? I thought open source was a considerable value here and Jobs and Apple/MAC were especially contrary by definition and design. To be able to experience and benefit from this "innovation", you had to pay many times over any similar or equivalent technology. And not just that, the prices were over and beyond the level of reasonable and fair. The best e.g., imho, is iTunes. 99 cents a song. The iStore.

It's strange what and who we value.

[susikala]

I also found Stallman's position very translucent. I actually found it over some Apple fanboy blog, who was appalled at how their master/god was treated by the pioneer of software freedom. It's amazing how those trolls twist everything out of context. Stallman didn't actually say he was happy about the death, he only said he was he happy jobs was gone, which is a really fair and much less personal statement.

I'm really laughing my ass off:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/technology/2011/10/steve-jobs-stallman-dissenting-view.html

This article just shows how superficially people work and how they only feed to mainstream opinions. Such press should just be kicked in the ****.

-Why is Stallman's view "a provocative take on technology issues" (what the hell are 'technology isses'? That sounds like the writer has no idea what they're talking about and trying to hide behind a really large common denominator), because it's true? Or is just provocative to apple fans (and thus to the American mainstream? has that nation gone so low?)
-"Founder of the free software (or open source)". Right. Since open source is free software. I'm going to use vbulletin's code the next time I come across it, since it's free software.
-"As one can surmise from that sendoff, Stallman’s and Jobs’ views on software as a business are diametrically opposed." Yes, apples and bananas are different. Rather, jobs didn't have any views of software, he was just a money craving freak. Stallman's the only one in the equation who actually ever cared about what software (or hardware) is or should be ethically.
-"Stallman's remarks have prompted an outpouring of indignation among the high-tech punditocracy, as though they were shocked at the rudeness of this famously outspoken activist's refusal to join the mass adoration of Apple's co-founder." Reads: some apple fanboys feel butthurt when they read the truth. Obviously.

The only positive highlight (which shows they have some brains) is the finale:
"Yet Stallman's critique of Jobs' business model has merit. For all Jobs' focus on user-friendly devices, Apple's buttoned-down approach to its software and apps, along with the way its mobile devices facilitate violations of their users' privacy, should be the subject of much broader concern. Stallman's eulogy may get wide distribution because of its tone, but his underlying point about the digital world deserves to be heeded."

[urfe]

another point why steve jobs was just evil.

No it's not. He was a ruthless business man, which is neither illegal or repulsive. This is how business works, and this is why so few succeed at it.

You have posts after posts of little anecdotes and Wikipedia quotes - and who in their right mind would use Wikipedia snippets as a valid source, when most of the people Steve Jobs worked with are still around, published books or expressed their personal, direct opinion about him, it's beyond me - which prove more about you than about Steve Jobs.

So:
1. don't quote Stallman, he's at such an extreme that it basically makes him a lunatic

2. don't argue about what he didn't do, or hypothetical discoveries that never took place - consider what he DID create

3. Let me quote Linus: "It?s not passion for something, it becomes passion against something else" - this is you, posting right now. Because (rich) people willingly buying Apple products means enslavement and exploitation. Jesus Christ, how biased can you get...

[scjet]

...now is the time for OpenHardware.

If it wasn't for the Steve Jobs there might not have been any PC hardware that Linux runs on today. We don't really know.
Steve Jobs is no worse than "ANY" other greedy patent-hungry corporate in America that only lives for his/her uber profits, while everyone else starves'. Its the "system" ppl that is screwed.

Of course Stallaman is right, I agree with him, but even if there wouldn't have been a Steve Jobs/Apple, then it just would have been a Motorola/Atari/Amiga ? instead that would have filled the vacuum or without Microsoft, it just would have conrtnued with IBM and it's PC, or some other greedy corporate. ....
But one thing is for sure, it would have been the same outcomes, -greedy patent-hungary Corps that "only" want uber profits all the time.
Stallman, and many others', have been screaming about this for years, ok fine, but no one has ever seen any other manufacturers', then or now, stepping up to the plate, to build "OpenHardware" !?
Hardware "costs" time, labour, materials ... ! just like anything else, -what does Stallman expect, have it built for nothing. ? There isn't anyone here who wouldn't gladly pay for a "real" GNU/PC.
And if so, would it also be built according to Stallman's GNU Standards' ???
Just look at the Linux Audio mess still, Stallman can't even get the different Linux camps together on any sortof "quality" approach -that's just one of many other internal examples.
Talking 'bout audio - I only own one stoopid Apple product, an iPOD. I think I bought it 4 or 5 years ago.
But it still works great. the sound quality is one of the best for its time, and still is. Yes it's closed propretary.... whatever.
Linux/Stallman sound can't even get that really right yet, and it's been decades.
Stallman should clean up his own GNU Linux backyard first too. As Linux/BSD advocates, we should "ALL be more vigilant. Beaching about steve Jobs, ain't gonna fix that.
I've have hated Microsoft and Apple so long, that I refused to buy into them (except for my iPOD), for atleast the last 7 years.

The changes Stallman wants would potentially involve tearing down our "existing" corrupted and broken Capitalist model, and replacing it with a new one, maybe even radically different one.
That ain't gonna happen anytime soon, unless we start a bloody revolution -think about it. All industries would be affected by something like this.

I'm thankful for Steve Jobs (well, moreso for the "WoZ") for building their Home Computer, back in '76, and later Jobs, for competeing fiercely with the IBM/Microsoft's PC scrap, ... It's becuase of ppl like Steve Jobs that we even have Hardware,... to install Linux/*BSD's on, in the first place. ! think about it
-it's not "open", but it could have been a lot worse.

Stallman didn't have to be such a cold-hearted Daemon about Steve Jobs - in the end, thats all.
Hey Stallman, We need "real" OpenHardware now, for OpenSource/GNU/BSD/Freesoftware Foundation/...whatever open software, for it to flourish and really grow !, instead of just you being an egotistical protester, all the time, a little more action, and a lot less words please - u 'ole timer.
Lets do it -I'm raring to go.

[susikala]

No it's not. He was a ruthless business man, which is neither illegal or repulsive. This is how business works, and this is why so few succeed at it.

You have posts after posts of little anecdotes and Wikipedia quotes - and who in their right mind would use Wikipedia snippets as a valid source, when most of the people Steve Jobs worked with are still around, published books or expressed their personal, direct opinion about him, it's beyond me - which prove more about you than about Steve Jobs.

So:
1. don't quote Stallman, he's at such an extreme that it basically makes him a lunatic

2. don't argue about what he didn't do, or hypothetical discoveries that never took place - consider what he DID create

3. Let me quote Linus: "It’s not passion for something, it becomes passion against something else" - this is you, posting right now. Because (rich) people willingly buying Apple products means enslavement and exploitation. Jesus Christ, how biased can you get...

From my perspective, he was evil. A ruthless businessman with no ethics is evil. That is the point. If you earn enough money than you could ever spend, more money than you'd ever need, more money than all the people you know taken together would ever need, and you still remain the way you are, that is evil. This is one of capitalism's dark sides. You know, that is the reason for the expression 'capitalist pigs'.

Your wikipedia argument doesn't hold. Wikipedia is somewhat of an omniuseful thing for most people. When it suits their arguments, it's useful and credible. When it's not, it's just the wikipedia any jackass can edit. But wikipedia has been mostly neutral, except its natural nerdy-white-boy-geek bias. Which is not going anywhere.

1. Why shouldn't people quote Stallman? He definitely did a lot more than jobs for a better world. Ever heard of OLPC XO-1? Know what runs it? Think such a thing would ever be possible with apple's software? With proprietary software? (other when Microsoft tries to give it away to win more potential users). In fact, even though people now quote jobs as someone who has done a lot to improve the world, I consider what he has done a step back after we've been slowly getting rid of Windows' hegemony. What makes RMS a lunatic? The fact you don't agree with his opinions? The fact he says what he thinks?
3. This is really just semantics, nothing more. A passion for something could always translate to a passion against something else.