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  • Originally posted by oiaohm View Post

    He is technically wrong.

    Cops, a firefighters and a paramedics who is light duties/office work only other than the physical parts they cannot do they have to be just as qualified as those who can do field work. Yes a paramedic in a wheelchair has to be able to perform CPR, do all the bandaging, be qualified to do the drug application and so on.

    A cop in a wheelchair still has to go to range and be firearm qualified. Firefighters in wheelchairs still have to take part in training activities normally as the injured victim stand in.

    Remember office work only/light duty cops, firefighters and a paramedics get paid less. Even that on paper office work only/light duty cops, a firefighters and a paramedics are more qualified in most cases than those doing field work/full duty.

    Something important light duty Cops, firefighters and a paramedics have to be able to instruct an off the street person picked basically at random to perform the tasks they cannot perform safely. Light duty Cops, firefighters and paramedics have to be instructors.

    O boy have I seen more than a few new able body cops, firefighters and paramedics be shocked to find out they have disqualified from field work because they have insulted their instructor who was missing a leg so is not allowed to-do field work. Yes there are a lot of cases where the person who decides what cop/firefighter/paramedic can be in the field is the disabled one in the station. Yes got disabled in the path of work it very important to teach this on to the new personal so they don't repeat the same mistake.

    Cops, firefighters and a paramedics for along time have valued experience disabled person can bring.

    If the police, fire or ambulance group is deploying their light duty offices there is something really wrong but something people are not aware of is that the last resort is deploy all offices to the field including the light duty ones. This is why the light duty offices training even for one in wheelchair is not done lightly.

    Yes by the time police, fire or ambulance need to deploy light duty the number of personal in light duty will not be enough to cover the disaster in most cases. This is why light duty are instructors they are do force multiply themselves by in the field training any able body they can to plug the gaps.

    Panix this is the problem. light duty cops, firefighters and a paramedics​ fill an important role the role does not require totally able body but does require quite a bit of situational awareness.

    A paramedic light duty in a wheelchair is expected to be able to instruct a team of 8 unqualified civilians if they are deployed to the field where a full duty paramedic is only expected to be able to instruct at max 3 unqualified civilians. Lets just say being a light duty paramedic is not a simple thing to be.

    Yes the full duty are deployed most commonly to the field. If you see light duty field with cops, firefighters and paramedics deployed something has gone really wrong this is why they have to be such highly skilled instructors at that point single person head count increase is really not going to do anything for the level of disaster that will cause them to be field deployed.

    Panix the field work thing you are also wrong on. Light duty are expect if the disaster is bad enough to perform field work in instructor way to force multiply by in field training civilians to fill gaps. General day to day you are not needing to deploy the personal for force multiply from civilians.

    Light duty and full duty cops, firefighters and a paramedics have different roles when field deployed.

    In a police, fire or ambulance station you have 3 groups types of personal.
    1) civilian these are not qualified to be sent in the field without a light duty or full duty. These are just paper pushers and not field qualified.
    2) full duty these are able body these are day to day used.
    3) light duty these are normally office bound but still highly qualified and instructors these are deployed at last option to field. These need to be able to force multiply as in train civilians in field to rapidly increase numbers

    Think about it something goes wrong large number of you full duty get hurt if your full duty were you all your instructors how would you train the new batch.

    Light duty and full duty are both field qualified. Yes the presume that there is no such thing as a wheelchair cop, firefighter or paramedic that could be field deployed is wrong. If you are seeing a wheelchair cop, firefighter or paramedic field deployed things have really gone wrong and you better be listening to instructions if you want to live.
    You're an idiot. You just admitted that if they're doing office work or can't do the physical work - they are paid less. That's it. Done. We're done here. Ciao.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Panix View Post
      You're an idiot. You just admitted that if they're doing office work or can't do the physical work - they are paid less. That's it. Done. We're done here. Ciao.
      Read my post again. Light Duty and Full duty are both field qualified. Paramedic light duty who is in a wheelchair is able to fully perform CPR and all the required

      Same applies to a cops. There are a lot of physical field work that does not require a fully able body.

      Panix cannot do physical work is wrong.
      I was at the Providence police headquarters this summer when I saw an unusual sight — a cop in a motorized wheelchair. I wondered why someone like that wasn't home on some kind of disability.


      There are example after example of people in wheelchairs doing field work for police/cops or paramedics or firefighters.

      There reality is wheelchair cop or paramedic without any other condition is able to do 98% of the field work of an able body cop or paramedic and are able to get to 100 percent with civilian assistance. The reality is people are not aware of this because they are not regularly deployed to the field.

      Firefighter is around 60% this is know from Hollywood firefighter in wheelchair. Being at a site of a fire keeping track of how many people are in the building and controlling the valves providing the water does not require able body person/fully duty.

      Light duty are expect if the disaster is bad enough to perform field work in instructor way to force multiply by in field training civilians to fill gaps

      Yes the person in wheelchair will get field deployed. Person in Wheelchair will be doing physical work. Not all physical work in the field require a fully able body.

      So its not cannot do physical work.

      Panix think about to be instructor you have to be able to demo to person how to do the job correctly yes 99% of what you need to demo is upper body actions.

      Reality Panix you are being a idiot. Person in wheelchair is not as badly disabled as one would first think. The wheelchair limits at times where they can go but there are lot of cases where the cop/firefighter/paramedic stuck in wheelchair doing a job frees up a full duty to do a different job.

      Would you want a cap/firefighter/paramedic team that was all in wheelchairs this is no you would.

      Light duty are the reserves if you were using military terms. Light duty are not required to have perfect medical and they are not required to be able to perform 100 percent of field duties but they must be able to perform a decent amount of field duties to free up full duty offices.

      Panix there is a difference between a light duty and a full duty yes both have their roles in the as a cop/firefighter/paramedic. Full duty with no light duty does not work out. Panix do remember able body people do get assigned to light duty next to people in wheelchairs and only expected do the duties that the person in a wheelchair is doing.

      Light duty firefighter that able body may not be certified to go inside building and fight the fire but it certified to count those in the building and operate the valves.

      Wheelchair people who are light duty have to match up able body light duty in what they can do. The light duty role in emergency services was not designed for people in Wheelchairs it was designed at first for trainee offices or for offices that have made mistakes in the field.. Yes a full duty office suspected of excessive force will be placed on light duties.

      Panix the limitations of light duty have nothing to-do with being in a wheelchair and the requirements of light duty was not written for person in wheelchair. Just people in wheelchairs have proven they can meet the bar of light duty. This is not DEI program to put them there. All it was original DEI by law allowed those in wheelchairs to try out against the same role requirements as able body light duty offices could and they provided that could do that successfully. Yes light duty offices have always been lower pay due to the less duties they have to do..

      Now lets say there is some equipment advancement for those in wheelchairs that allows them to be as functional as full duty able body we could see a wheelchair full duty.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by oiaohm View Post

        Read my post again. Light Duty and Full duty are both field qualified. Paramedic light duty who is in a wheelchair is able to fully perform CPR and all the required

        Same applies to a cops. There are a lot of physical field work that does not require a fully able body.

        Panix cannot do physical work is wrong.
        I was at the Providence police headquarters this summer when I saw an unusual sight — a cop in a motorized wheelchair. I wondered why someone like that wasn't home on some kind of disability.


        There are example after example of people in wheelchairs doing field work for police/cops or paramedics or firefighters.

        There reality is wheelchair cop or paramedic without any other condition is able to do 98% of the field work of an able body cop or paramedic and are able to get to 100 percent with civilian assistance. The reality is people are not aware of this because they are not regularly deployed to the field.

        Firefighter is around 60% this is know from Hollywood firefighter in wheelchair. Being at a site of a fire keeping track of how many people are in the building and controlling the valves providing the water does not require able body person/fully duty.

        Light duty are expect if the disaster is bad enough to perform field work in instructor way to force multiply by in field training civilians to fill gaps

        Yes the person in wheelchair will get field deployed. Person in Wheelchair will be doing physical work. Not all physical work in the field require a fully able body.

        So its not cannot do physical work.

        Panix think about to be instructor you have to be able to demo to person how to do the job correctly yes 99% of what you need to demo is upper body actions.

        Reality Panix you are being a idiot. Person in wheelchair is not as badly disabled as one would first think. The wheelchair limits at times where they can go but there are lot of cases where the cop/firefighter/paramedic stuck in wheelchair doing a job frees up a full duty to do a different job.

        Would you want a cap/firefighter/paramedic team that was all in wheelchairs this is no you would.

        Light duty are the reserves if you were using military terms. Light duty are not required to have perfect medical and they are not required to be able to perform 100 percent of field duties but they must be able to perform a decent amount of field duties to free up full duty offices.

        Panix there is a difference between a light duty and a full duty yes both have their roles in the as a cop/firefighter/paramedic. Full duty with no light duty does not work out. Panix do remember able body people do get assigned to light duty next to people in wheelchairs and only expected do the duties that the person in a wheelchair is doing.

        Light duty firefighter that able body may not be certified to go inside building and fight the fire but it certified to count those in the building and operate the valves.

        Wheelchair people who are light duty have to match up able body light duty in what they can do. The light duty role in emergency services was not designed for people in Wheelchairs it was designed at first for trainee offices or for offices that have made mistakes in the field.. Yes a full duty office suspected of excessive force will be placed on light duties.

        Panix the limitations of light duty have nothing to-do with being in a wheelchair and the requirements of light duty was not written for person in wheelchair. Just people in wheelchairs have proven they can meet the bar of light duty. This is not DEI program to put them there. All it was original DEI by law allowed those in wheelchairs to try out against the same role requirements as able body light duty offices could and they provided that could do that successfully. Yes light duty offices have always been lower pay due to the less duties they have to do..

        Now lets say there is some equipment advancement for those in wheelchairs that allows them to be as functional as full duty able body we could see a wheelchair full duty.
        You're a brainwashed moron to the nth degree. Use common sense. One 'feel good' story by some obscure publication doesn't change the fact, that someone would be severely limited on the field in that condition or similar condition. You just argue the most moronic of points and narratives. This is my last reply. I have nothing against disabled ppl - just looking at it practically (I have a disability, myself).

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Panix View Post
          You're a brainwashed moron to the nth degree. Use common sense. One 'feel good' story by some obscure publication doesn't change the fact, that someone would be severely limited on the field in that condition or similar condition. You just argue the most moronic of points and narratives. This is my last reply. I have nothing against disabled ppl - just looking at it practically (I have a disability, myself).
          No this is you over presuming.

          There reality is wheelchair cop or paramedic without any other condition is able to do 98% of the field work of an able body cop or paramedic and are able to get to 100 percent with civilian assistance.
          This is taken directly from a study into it. Yes being in a wheelchair does limit but not as much as one would first think with cop and paramedic.

          Firefighter is only at 60% because they do in fact have to man handle another human more.

          Panix the severely limit part is false. The 2% of cop work that a wheelchair cop cannot do is the 2% of cop work that sees able body cops get injured and not being able to do their job. There is another reason why wheelchair cops are not field deployed as much is half that 2% limitation technically can be covered by shoot first ask questions latter basically give up on taking non cooperative suspect alive this is allowed in total emergency.

          People think of being in a wheelchair as a server limitation its not as server as you would first think for cops and paramedic work because a person in wheelchair can do the majority of those two jobs. Cops you don't want wheelchair ones in field by default because the means to counter the wheelchair limitation is increase non cooperative suspect death rates.

          Paramedics in wheelchair turns out that wheelchair width and dimensions are based the paramedics stretcher this is why building codes required door ways and so on to be particular dimensions. Yes stretchers are designed to go all the way to floor so you can roll person on to stretchers. Majority of paramedics work is in wheelchair accessible areas. Also take a car crash or equal full duty can have got the victims out of cars and so on the light duty in wheelchairs can be taking care of monitoring and transport.

          Panix you really do need to look at this practically those doing the studies into this did. They did not say person in Wheelchair was not limited but instead said their limitation was not in majority of cases(over 90% for cops and paramedics) any adverse effect on field work in fact the extra body even with limitations would still be advantage to getting the field work done. Its common for person with disability not to apply to be a cop or paramedic because they think their disability will be a major limitation when it really just a minor limitation that will just restrict them to being a light duty officer. Cops and Paramedics need a percentage of light duty officers to keep everything running smoothly.

          Lets say person said a full duty cop/paramedic/fire fighter I would not have had any argument with current affordable tech a person in wheelchair cannot do those roles. There is work to give person in wheelchair means to walk by exoskeleton but those are not cost effective yet. Yes person in exoskeleton can lift more than a able body person can without exoskeleton. So one day all paramedics might be required to be in exoskeletons to prevent back injury on job and at that point disabled legs may no longer be a factor at all. This is the thing the 2 percent the person in wheelchair cannot do of a paramedics role is the tasks that see able body paramedics get hurt and come victim themselves in the long term. Paramedics are most likely the first in emergency that people who are wheelchair bound today will come equal to a able body due to technology advancement. Yes due to need for paramedics in future to use exoskeletons to reduce injury. Population getting over weight equals more hurt able body paramedics due to the over weight person being too heavy to move this is what going to force the exoskeletons and exoskeletons remove the wheel chair limitations.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Panix View Post
            You're an idiot. You just admitted that if they're doing office work or can't do the physical work - they are paid less. That's it. Done. We're done here. Ciao.
            By the way 15 years ago no police office/cop was able to be light duty certified. The wheelchair technology was not available for them to pass. Because it was impossible to pass range certification from a sitting position. Yes this required standing wheelchair that can handle the firearm recoil to be able to pass light duty certification. Yes quite a bit of recoil when some light duty certifications around the world have required of use of double barrel shot guns. Yes the first standing wheelchair is from 1975 but the first ones to handle the recoil of shooting a gun is only in the last 15 years.

            As wheelchairs have evolved how limited a person is in a wheelchair has reduced. The final step in wheelchair evolution would be exoframes designed for disabled.

            Emergency services for firefighters and paramedics are looking at exoframes for able body to reduce injuries. At some point in future person in wheelchair will be able to pass full duty certification for firefighters and paramedics because everyone at that point will be using exoframes while on the job in those roles so making the disabled legs not important.

            This is why blanket statements that a person in wheelchair cannot be lot of different roles is flawed. The reality if a person in wheelchair and just lower body motor control putting them in the wheelchair its only a current technology limitation why they cannot do the role. Mostly that the technology is not generally affordable and not fully refined.
            Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

            Panix watch the above video then think what decade more refinement is going todo particularly if we have wars funding research into making more cost effective exoframes to allow disable solders to remain in field usage..

            The gap between able body person and person in wheel chair is reducing.

            Comment

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