Debian May Need To Re-Evaluate Its Interest In "Init System Diversity"

[andyprough]

The answer to all this Debian init system conflict has been in plain sight for quite awhile: Devuan! https://devuan.org
If Debian without systemd is desired, use the equivalent Devuan version and be glad you did. Simple.

I'm pretty sure that MX Linux is the far more popular of the non-systemd Debian derivatives. So much so that it's probably the fastest growing distro in the world right now in terms of expansion of the installed base. In fact, I'll bet MX users are causing a great deal of the consternation among the elongind opponents within the Debian project. MX is using Debian's repositories, and is becoming a driving force for the future of Debian. Debian maintainers don't really have the option of just killing support for elogind, even though some of them would clearly like to think they could ignore it and it would go away.

[Hibbelharry]

Is the author of systemd any better than rms? Probably not, and neither is his view of "Linux or nothing". Systemd is completely the wrong way to go about compatibility, but what is required for the lackeys to realize that?

I think compatibilty is really no issue to the systemd maintainers, they want to go forward. From my standpoint, liking progress and innovation, I think thats a quite valid and reasonable idea and the way to go. Other OS might implement interfaces like the ones from the systemd services, and they're good to go. There are already other partial implementations for the same software interfaces, those would just need to get more attention. They just won't be able to keep up, if they go on neglecting to innovate.

[Tuxee]

Okay, but just understand: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_AIw9bGogo

Nice. And true.

[q2dg]

Is the author of systemd any better than rms? Probably not, and neither is his view of "Linux or nothing". Systemd is completely the wrong way to go about compatibility, but what is required for the lackeys to realize that?

Compatibility (between Unix systems, I understand) is very overrated. What really matters is compatibility between Linux systems, which is precisely what Systemd provides

[NotMine999]

If Debian goes the route of being systemd only, then what is their distinguishing feature, compelling reason for users to choose it instead of some other Linux distro that also uses systemd, or, perish the thought, also uses Debian's own source?

Long-term support release? Redhat and Ubuntu already do that.

Fancy desktops? Boxes full of distros already do that.

Some sort of super-duper, solves every issue distribution installer and updater? Seriously, that's all you got? There's APT, pacman, and many others. Pick one.

I am pretty certain I have mentioned this in the past, maybe even years ago, but lack of feature diversity between various Linux distributions simply calls up the question to the marketplace: "Why do they bother to exist when they seem so much alike?"

Those fancy desktop interfaces that most distributions tout, and some are little more than "skins", isn't enough to make them a lasting product in the marketplace...even if the marketplace is "free".

A critical factor in the marketplace success of any product is focusing on "distinguishing features" and "compelling reasons to use the product" rather than just being another "me too!" product.

[andyprough]

Compatibility (between Unix systems, I understand) is very overrated. What really matters is compatibility between Linux systems, which is precisely what Systemd provides

Linux is not an OS. So "compatibility between Linux systems" is just a mythical objective that will never be obtained. Just say what you really want - "I want RedHat, Fedora, Ubuntu, Debian, SUSE,opensuse , and Arch to all work the same". Once you honestly name the real objective, you should realize you are already there. Since you don't really care about Gentoo or Puppy or antiX or Void or Hyperbola or a thousand other projects, there's no reason to lump them all together under this mythical "Linux OS" umbrella.

[hotaru]

I think this says a lot about the current state of Linux without systemd:

[oleid]

If Debian goes the route of being systemd only, then what is their distinguishing feature, compelling reason for users to choose it instead of some other Linux distro that also uses systemd, or, perish the thought, also uses Debian's own source?

Well, what was Debian's selling point before systemd was born and adopted? I'm positive the reasons to use Debian didn't change a lot since then.

[bachchain]

Is the author of systemd any better than rms? Probably not, and neither is his view of "Linux or nothing". Systemd is completely the wrong way to go about compatibility, but what is required for the lackeys to realize that?

Who wrote systemd and their opinions doesn't matter. What matters is that distro maintainers want it, but what is required for the lackeys to realize that?

[uxmkt]

The title was clearly designed to clickbait, right?

You... do recognize you have come to Phoronix, right?