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Systemd-Free Debian "Devuan" Planning Their First Developer Gathering This Spring

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  • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    yeah, each LTS distribution ships outdated software and macthing manpages
    tell me something new
    Then why bring out the man-pages, lol

    Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    because you pretended systemd has obsoleted ifconfig which is bullshit
    Yeah, get over your hard-on, willya

    Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    why are you using such a long command when you say short is beatuier than clear given the char numbers of "ip" versus "ifconfig"
    Because the one with 6 extra characters is same across many operating systems, while "short" one is only used in Linux.

    Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    why don't you then just install your Slowaris and pray that it has some meaining until you retrire?
    Solaris being slow is just a legend linux-fanboys like to fancy because of their inferiority-complexes. Besides, in enterprise, performance is not the major parameter, stability is. When it comes to stability Solaris wins hands-down, only RHEL would be able to compete. You should know it, without me telling it to you. I am actually using Solaris-based file-server at home now, OmniOS is quite nice. Besides FreeBSD-based firewall-router/WiFi-AP/IDS-IPS (all in one). Linux is a distinct minority here though I use it too.
    Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    you are simply talking bullshit because you have no idea how to püerate a systemd driven setup and run away by the first issue screaming "systemd is bad" while at the same time ypu did not have the same idiotic behavior when started to use unixoid systems at all and i doubt that everything did from the first moment what you liked it to do before understand basics
    You seem to have very little idea that all the cases you've been presenting here as major arguments of systemd are actually repeatable on other systems. I could bond, bridge and group interfaces all day relying on basic text editor, relative device files and traditional BSD rc.d or OpenRC. Easy as a pie. And I dont need to RTFM for it. At all. Same applies to checking for service status and restarting when needed. It's a capability been present on BSD like..forever.

    It was year 2002 or 2003 when I was renting SoF2 game server, which was running on FreeBSD 4. Compared to other service providers, it restarted game server process automatically when it was brought down by buffer overflow exploit plaguing SoF2 back then. Linux-based SoF2 game servers, once crashed, remained down until manually started.

    Suddenly Linux got systemd and with it service status/autorestarting capability, which are like major features never seen before for you. It's hilarious.

    Once having learned something, I don't have literal need to re-learn after every update on 'Unixoids'. They differ somewhat between each-other, especially between OS families, but inside OS-families less so than two random linux distributions or even 2 different versions of a single Linux distribution.

    How much free time do you have? I've got family, job and limited free time. I don't want to use it for endlessly reading the flippin manuals/browsing forums over each minor or greater change. If your work is spent behind computer screen and you don't have personal life - of course you can entertain yourself with the minuteae of slightest 'progress'. I don't have the time nor will. I would if systemd would actually work as advertised across lots of updates and long time spans. Then I would feel time spent messing with it would be justified. As it is, it's time wasted. I can do same things different ways and these setups won't break randomly at some point in future.

    Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    they all except BSD are dying for sure in the next years, BSD will be a niche for people like you but gioven that BSD developers lloking lso at systemd/launchd you will not get as old as you like it there too without learning new things after 30 years
    Nah, nope. BSD user base looks to be increasing thanks to systemd Could happen systemd-kernel will eat Linux kernel out, before Solaris and commercial Unices finally die out. You never know if Poettering would decide to gradually start replacing Linux kernel with it's own systemd-kernel. On a mobile market Linux could be thrown out by Google's Fuchsia.
    Solaris is safe until at least 2034. Enterprise support contracts

    Originally posted by hreindl View Post
    simple question; why do you not creep away, use BSD/Solaris and shutup?
    Linux is systemd and itäs here to stay - it's that easy, deal with it or creep away
    Well, why don't you? It's not systemd thread. It's devuan's. And I use devuan somewhat, besides Alpine and Void Linux. Though my main systems run BSD (Free- and DragonFly), in one case Solaris, both of my laptops run systemd'less Linux too. For parents I've even installed Linux with a systemd on their laptops - because banking software authenticating through national identity (smart)cards requires Ubuntu (or some other distro that software's been ported to, like OpenSUSE).


    • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
      because i did not live undr a stone in the past decade?
      You sure seem to.
      Originally posted by hreindl View Post
      yeah, what a grown up reaction when got proven to talk bullshit or better outright lies
      Are YOU really trying to talk about "grown up reaction", ROFL..
      Originally posted by hreindl View Post
      who cares about other operating systems in 2019?
      Pretty stupid opinion, considering that except for web servers, it's more often than not (~60-70% depending of the exact type of organization) actually Windows servers running in companies/organization's intranet's. No good free alternative to MS's integrated business software solutions. Cheaper to pay than develop own or use haphazardly fitting puzzle of free components, which upon failures are costing more in interrupted work. Linux's share there is about 10-15%.

      Originally posted by hreindl View Post
      well, and i run everything on a single RAID10 SSD Fedora machine for many years
      Get over the opinion that you equal the Universum. Serious problem with ego.
      Last edited by aht0; 03-17-2019, 06:57 AM.


      • Well, if it annoys you, keep away. Simple.
        Since you seem to offer free neurological diagnosis, yours is "obsessive-compulsive behaviour". Once you notice news item even remotely related to somebody ditching systemd, you cannot keep away.

        From one angle it is funny as hell watching you two raging and from the other, it's plain pathetic.


        • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
          summary: your problem with systemd is that it don't care for other operating systems and hence make use of Linux capabilities without compromises

          so be it, then don't use Linux and you are done, it's that easy

          you need it for your job?
          seek a different one where you can take control over your little world, it's that easy
          Says the retard who whines in a Devuan thread about it. Don't like it and systemd bashing? Then seek a different thread praising your systemd wife. It's that easy.


          • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
            read that fucking thread from the begin!

            i didn't care of it as long systemd-haters did not stop spear lies and FUD again and so why can't you little fuckers just not use whatever and shut up instead talk about things you don't understand?
            No YOU shut the fuck up because you're lying like a piece of shit when I know that I got that conflict and you didn't even try it so STFU.

            Just because YOU claim something is a lie doesn't make it so. In fact, you are the one lying, and anyone who wants to see it for themselves can follow the procedure to get that conflict.

            Now shut the fuck up hypocrite.


            • Originally posted by hreindl View Post

              sadly someone deleted your last comment with likely foam in front of the mouth i wanted to see :-)
              It was me. I decided you are not worth my time for constant back-and-forth and I have better things to do.

              Your "hard facts" amounted to correcting my assumption about ifconfig pushed aside by systemd. That was sole fact you were correct in.

              Rest of the crap you been posting amounts to claiming "systemd works fine for me although I have to disable parts of it that doesn't work". Contradiction in itself.

              Rest of it from you was pure denial and ceaseless immature personal attacks.


              • I neither drink, smoke nor tolerate childish zealots with a narrower worldview than worm's asshole​​​.

                All that I think now seeing any of your posts, is backquoting yourself



                • Bla

                  Systemd thread for you


                  • Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                    Ifconfig is ONLY deprecated on GNU/Linux. It's still standard network configuration utility across BSD's, Solaris variants, OSX and commercial Unices (like AIX).
                    Solaris and AIX are more or less deprecated whole and MacOS isn't designed for using commandline nor calling commandline tools to do shit. It's actually just BSDs that still use it in real deployments.
                    But still, that's not the main point.
                    So, tell me one good reason to start using another utilities (iproute2 package) when these are not used anywhere besides Linux AND offer less verbose and machine-readable/parsable output to top it off.

                    tl;dr: Linux's ifconfig is not the same as BSD's (so any point about inter-interoperability is bullshit, it's just a different tool with the same name) as on BSD it is using a BSD-only kernel interface.
                    Due to this reason it has deficiencies and can't work on various modern network configurations.
                    Since this was more or less a big undertaking it was worth it to write something like ip that combines the functionality of ifconfig, route, arp, and ndp as with the better linux-only interface you could do that so why the fuck not.