Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Systemd-Free Debian "Devuan" Planning Their First Developer Gathering This Spring

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    Shorter and more concise it is, more beautiful it becomes. Mine is shorter, both line-wise and by character count.
    yours does a lot less than setup 4 NICs with one active-passive-bondig and one bridge, configuire NIC and so on
    and wh would you use "ifconfig" intead "ip" when "sorther is more beautiful"

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    Precise network details I would specify differently.
    bla

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    Systemd replaced legacy network configuration utilities like "ifconfig", I'd use these.
    and now you have proven how little knowledge you have, "ifconfig" belongs to "net-tools" and is depreated for 15 years by it's successor "iproute2" from where the command "ip" from my sample is

    rpm -q --file /usr/sbin/ifconfig
    net-tools-2.0-0.51.20160912git.fc28.x86_64

    when you first say "sorther is more beautiful" why in the world would you use "ifconfig" instead "ip"?

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    As a result, init itself has less possible points of failure. Because init's main task is to initialize the boot, not trying to do hundred other things simultaneously on background at the same time. Most reliablie tools, both in software and hardware, always follow the KISS principle. Keep It Simple, Stupid.
    hell there is no difference at this specific point between calling some shellscript or a oneshot-unit with dozen ExecStart and as said you could place them all into a script and call this with ExecStart too

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    Privatedevices analogue would be "jails". Notice "keyword -jail -prefix -stop -shutdown". This file was taken from FreeBSD box with an OpenRC init. The fact that something might carry different name, does not mean your "hardening" is not present. About possible error messages, I'd get these from syslog - a non-issue.
    stop beeing that childish when you want to be taken serious!

    PrivateDevcies is one of many possible *granular* hardening options but as you don't read what you answer to at all and have obvisouly no clue what are we talking about...

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    You won't see shit like "Timeout for 1min 30sec" in OpenRC, which is so common with systemd when it has hit some rocks and shoals and tries to figure out how to proceed.
    i have never seen this at boot anyways and at shutdown when something don't react properly to "stop"it depends if kill it hard ould be that good because databases don't like it and you can control this Timeouts anyways per unit or global, this is just a safe default - yeah i know when you have to configure or learn something it's bad but that's your fault

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    OpenRC just boots. I've gotten FreeBSD to below 10 seconds boot with it-which is awesome considering it's normally like 30 seconds with traditional RC init.
    so what, iam down between 2.2 and 6 ms on virtual servers and 15 seconds on my 8 years lod workstation

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    Alpine Linux does it even much faster (also OpenRC).
    maybe you should learn to cleanup your setups....

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    When I have to install OpenSUSE (systemd distro) I am waiting 1-5min pretty much on first boot after install
    god damned whine at OpenSUSE, that's not relevant to systemd

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    And it always requires modifications when I changed something about local file systems or drives.
    bla

    Originally posted by aht0 View Post
    I have wife and mother-in-law doing their nagging, I don't need some system manager adding to it.
    bla

    Comment


    • Originally posted by aht0 View Post
      When it gets on my way, sure, I dislike any change. When it fixes something broken for me, I am fine with it.
      that as answer to "the point is that you are not willing or able to cope with changes and when someone is not willing to begin with it won't work well" explains it all - you dislike any change and so you disklike that you get washed away because you decided to work in an industry which is all about change

      now you have found systemd to reflect your selfhate about a job you dislike at all because it's about change and nobody will stop the world for you just to keep you safe and warm with that little stuff you know not willing to open your mind and so you get washed away sooner or later and believe systemd is doing that, no it's only making your anyways happening washing away caused by your attitude faster

      RTFM or retire

      given that you fucking don't read or even try to understand what you reply to just shut up, everone knows that you are dumb in the meantime
      Last edited by hreindl; 03-16-2019, 08:17 AM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by aht0 View Post
        It is said "Beauty is in the eyes of beholder". Shorter and more concise it is, more beautiful it becomes. Mine is shorter, both line-wise and by character count. Precise network details I would specify differently. Systemd replaced legacy network configuration utilities like "ifconfig", I'd use these. As a result, init itself has less possible points of failure. Because init's main task is to initialize the boot, not trying to do hundred other things simultaneously on background at the same time. Most reliablie tools, both in software and hardware, always follow the KISS principle. Keep It Simple, Stupid.
        Amen.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
          bla
          That's how all of your posts appear to me.

          Can't argue with blindfolded ignorant who refuses to acknowledge facts.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Weasel View Post
            That's how all of your posts appear to me.

            Can't argue with blindfolded ignorant who refuses to acknowledge facts.
            as people like you ever brought any facts while you guys even don't look at config samples because that would probably lead in destroy your idiotic prejustice of everything

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Weasel View Post
              Amen.
              Amen to bullshit like "Systemd replaced legacy network configuration utilities like ifconfig" which is nothing than a outright lie

              * ifconfig is part of net-tools
              * net-tools is deprecated for a decade (https://lwn.net/Articles/710533/)
              * /etc/init.d/network is a completly different beast
              * both, net-tools and /etc/init.d/network are still there in Fedora 28
              * how can systemd which is in Fedora for 8 years now have replaced something which is still there
              * yes, it's now about to disappear, in F29 you get deprectaion warning for /etc/init.d/network
              * but again: it is there and so none of both was replaced by systemd

              when something is about to replace /etc/init.d/network it's NetworkManager which has nothing to do with systemd at all because it's independent and exists way longer and so both of you have a head full of shit with the imagination systemd is guilty for every decision independent developers, maintainers and os-suppliers are making

              and then you idiots talk about "facts"? seriously?
              Last edited by hreindl; 03-16-2019, 10:06 AM.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
                that as answer to "the point is that you are not willing or able to cope with changes and when someone is not willing to begin with it won't work well" explains it all - you dislike any change and so you disklike that you get washed away because you decided to work in an industry which is all about change

                now you have found systemd to reflect your selfhate about a job you dislike at all because it's about change and nobody will stop the world for you just to keep you safe and warm with that little stuff you know not willing to open your mind and so you get washed away sooner or later and believe systemd is doing that, no it's only making your anyways happening washing away caused by your attitude faster

                RTFM or retire

                given that you fucking don't read or even try to understand what you reply to just shut up, everone knows that you are dumb in the meantime
                If you want me to actually read lots of what you type, dial down with personal attacks. I've already said once I see those, I'll just be skipping your posts

                Do much extrapolation without actually knowing personally? Go into hate-speex much, because you simply lack proper arguments? LOL

                I might as well claim that you are so stuck on systemd because SysV init was for you exceedingly bad experience, leaving you psychologically scarred, you were reaching the first straw (as systemd came to exist) and now are utterly terrified of letting go and looking at alternatives - no matter how unreliable the systemd is - you are rather ready to disable it's multitude problematic functionalities than look elsewhere.

                Do I really HAVE TO cope with "changes" (as you see systemd) when alternative options offer much more solid experience? You can feel free to trail each progressive change like a faithful dog if you like. I know what I require and I use software accordingly.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  If you want me to actually read lots of what you type, dial down with personal attacks. I've already said once I see those, I'll just be skipping your posts
                  when you don't read anything why answer at all?

                  Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  Do much extrapolation without actually knowing personally? Go into hate-speex much, because you simply lack proper arguments? LOL
                  when you don't read what do you expect?

                  Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  I might as well claim that you are so stuck on systemd because SysV init was for you exceedingly bad experience, leaving you psychologically scarred
                  the only one psychologically scarred is you when it comes to systemd

                  Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  you were reaching the first straw (as systemd came to exist) and now are utterly terrified of letting go and looking at alternatives - no matter how unreliable the systemd is - you are rather ready to disable it's multitude problematic functionalities than look elsewhere.
                  well, when it works for 8 years in production on vservers, hosts, network storages, routers, firewalls, desktop-machines for me like a charme you can't tell me about unreliable

                  Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  Do I really HAVE TO cope with "changes" (as you see systemd) when alternative options offer much more solid experience?
                  with your closed mindest you are not in the position to talk about "more solid experience"

                  Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  You can feel free to trail each progressive change like a faithful dog if you like.
                  nosense, i likely fight harder then you against "change for the sake of change" all the years but i am not stubborn

                  Originally posted by aht0 View Post
                  I know what I require and I use software accordingly.
                  so do i and migration to systemd was no big deal and given how late you users of other distributions got to face it when it was much more mature as when i started i simply don't get that stubborn attitude "i have done this always exactly that way and so i continue, i don't make real expierience but talk a lot with no deep knowledge what i am talking about"

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by hreindl View Post

                    Amen to bullshit like "Systemd replaced legacy network configuration utilities like ifconfig" which is nothing than a outright lie

                    * ifconfig is part of net-tools
                    * net-tools is deprecated for a decade (https://lwn.net/Articles/710533/)
                    * /etc/init.d/network is a completly different beast
                    * both, net-tools and /etc/init.d/network are still there in Fedora 28
                    * how can systemd which is in Fedora for 8 years now have replaced something which is still there
                    * yes, it's now about to disappear, in F29 you get deprectaion warning for /etc/init.d/network
                    * but again: it is there and so none of both was replaced by systemd

                    when something is about to replace /etc/init.d/network it's NetworkManager which has nothing to do with systemd at all because it's independent and exists way longer and so both of you have a head full of shit with the imagination systemd is guilty for every decision independent developers, maintainers and os-suppliers are making

                    and then you idiots talk about "facts"? seriously?
                    Check your own "facts". Some distros still use ifconfig, some distros deprecated it less than 5 years a go - not every distro is a instant copy-cat of Fedora. FYI: NetworkManager is purely Linux software. It does not work ouside Linux desktops. Came out of your 'Linux-cave', it's the reason of your tunnel vision.

                    Ifconfig is ONLY deprecated on GNU/Linux. It's still standard network configuration utility across BSD's, Solaris variants, OSX and commercial Unices (like AIX). So, tell me one good reason to start using another utilities (iproute2 package) when these are not used anywhere besides Linux AND offer less verbose and machine-readable/parsable output to top it off.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by hreindl View Post
                      when you don't read anything why answer at all?
                      when you don't read what do you expect?
                      the only one psychologically scarred is you when it comes to systemd
                      well, when it works for 8 years in production on vservers, hosts, network storages, routers, firewalls, desktop-machines for me like a charme you can't tell me about unreliable
                      with your closed mindest you are not in the position to talk about "more solid experience"
                      nosense, i likely fight harder then you against "change for the sake of change" all the years but i am not stubborn
                      so do i and migration to systemd was no big deal and given how late you users of other distributions got to face it when it was much more mature as when i started i simply don't get that stubborn attitude "i have done this always exactly that way and so i continue, i don't make real expierience but talk a lot with no deep knowledge what i am talking about"
                      LOL. At one point claiming it "works like a charm" for you then talking about how he disabled bunch of functionalities from the thing that was supposedly "working like a charm".

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X