Red Hat Picks Up Another Graphics Driver Developer

[Hamish Wilson]

It turns out in Fedora 18 they have replaced system-config-firewall with a new interface called firewalld anyway, which is available from the AUR. So I have uninstalled ufw and gufw and I am using that now, and once I got the daemon started it is working fine. I guess that settles that then.

[Hamish Wilson]

How about you?

Cheers, you got it working.

EDIT: as far as system-config-firewall, if you are using KDE then there is a great plugin for System Settings to use UFW. Otherwise...not sure honestly. I only use UFW and I pretty much only use KDE these days (some E17 thrown in, but hten I just use the GTK client for UFW lol)

I use Xfce instead so I opted on using the gufw interface from AUR. But thanks for the suggestion.

EDIT 2: Congrats on becoming the reincarnate of the Devil, Hamish! (Your post count is 666 right now lol XD)

Great, I will now never post again so that I can keep the number... god damn it, I posted here didn't I?

[Ericg]

Someone on this forum did a test of audio latency. ALSA had less latency, yes, but the increased latency from pulse was equivalent to moving your speakers 6 feet farther away. So other then for pro-audio, nobody cares.

You and Liam are both right.

Pulse's additional latency (when properly configured) is basically just the extra time to pass through another software layer.

Most lag problems could be solved by doing a PLL-model in Alsa. For the record, a PLL model is the same model that Apple uses in OS X and it does work beautifully. The problem is it is FIENDISHLY hard to get right and very hardware specific-- an advantage Apple has since it controls the hardware.

Could we do it? Yes, but itd be as fickle as all hell

[n3wu53r]

Someone on this forum did a test of audio latency. ALSA had less latency, yes, but the increased latency from pulse was equivalent to moving your speakers 6 feet farther away. So other then for pro-audio, nobody cares.

[liam]

I've got the exact same setup and everything works perfectly. The only issue I have is NetworkManager and either my wireless card/router dont play nice (occasional silent disconnects).

So, no, we dont "like to be punished," we dont "like hot pokers," just because you two dont like the software or its ideas/design doesn't make it bad software.

And if either one of you goes and jumps at "PulseAudio has lag! It broke my sound setup 3 years ago!" then you guys are idiots. Software has bugs. Live with it. Bugs get fixed, software improves. I haven't had a single issue with Pulse in about 2 years now,.

Yes, Pulse has some lag if you're trying to get under 10ms latency, but its not designed for the pro users who want under 10ms latency. You want pro-level audio? Try JACK or JACK2, thats software for you guys. Pulse is the solution for the 'usual' use cases. (last I checked dmix-- which was about a year ago-- is still a mess if you want headphone support and you still cant move streams between audio outputs which is important if you have a home theater setup like I do)

Systemd? No problems since early Fedora 17.

Networkmanager? Aside from the problem above, it works perfectly.

System-config-printer? Meh, I prefer the KDE KCM for printing but to each their own.

I don't believe pa's lag is because of its own code so much as ALSAs. From what I've recently learned it seems like PA would work beautifully for pro if alsa used a pll model for buffer estimation. That, apparently, is a very big deal to make work, though.

Anyways, happy to hear Rob is coming to Westford. Although I still wish they'd offer a small satellite office in Cambridge

[Ericg]

I've never used iptables so I don't know enough about it to help.

And as far as your choice of software... to each his own.... Thats the best thing about linux is that you have the choice to use what you want. It is my personal opinion that your choices include the most buggy, bloated, and slowest software that can be used.

But please understand that my opinion is biased and you should choose what works best for you.

I completly disagree with you, duby, as far as 'buggy, bloated and slowest' but at least youre 50x better than some people on these forums and aren't a like raving lunatic of "YOURE WRONG YOUR MOTHERS WRONG FUCK LENNART AND ANYTHING HE"S EVER EVEN LOOKED OUT. IM THE BEST!!!!!"

Again, I disagree with you, but sincere props and kudos for being civil about it

[duby229]

Actually, everything is running smooth as silk thank you very much, just as I expected it to. I really do not get the knee jerk "Learnet Pottering is bad crowd". systemd is a real blessing when you have to manually manage services the way you do with Arch and PulseAudio and pavucontrol are a real blessing when handling the volume of multiple applications or if you are using a headset.

Moving on, I also honestly do not get why anyone could hate on NetworkManger if you want a dynamic and responsive interface to handle such things. When it comes to SystemConfig though it is mostly that I am used to it after using Fedora for six years, but it does generally work and my printer works with it perfectly. The main thing I am missing on Arch is system-config-firewall.

Speaking of which, if there is one thing that is not working perfectly, it is iptables:


So if you actually want to be helpful and stop shooting your mouths off you can actually help me figure that one out.

I've never used iptables so I don't know enough about it to help.

And as far as your choice of software... to each his own.... Thats the best thing about linux is that you have the choice to use what you want. It is my personal opinion that your choices include the most buggy, bloated, and slowest software that can be used.

But please understand that my opinion is biased and you should choose what works best for you.

[Ericg]

Speaking of which, if there is one thing that is not working perfectly, it is iptables:


So if you actually want to be helpful and stop shooting your mouths off you can actually help me figure that one out.

In order do:

cd /etc/iptables/

su

iptables-save > iptables.rules

systemctl start iptables

systemctl status iptables

(sudo wont work. Have to be real root to use iptables-save)

It work now?

I didnt have iptables set up on my laptop so I took 5minutes or so to try to get it working--failed at first like yours too. journalctl -xn showed iptables.service complaining that it couldnt find /etc/iptables/iptables.rules, quick check of the arch wiki showed this section: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php...iguration_file little fooling around with it, and i got it working.

How about you?



EDIT: as far as system-config-firewall, if you are using KDE then there is a great plugin for System Settings to use UFW. Otherwise...not sure honestly. I only use UFW and I pretty much only use KDE these days (some E17 thrown in, but hten I just use the GTK client for UFW lol)

EDIT 2: Congrats on becoming the reincarnate of the Devil, Hamish! (Your post count is 666 right now lol XD)

[Hamish Wilson]

Actually, everything is running smooth as silk thank you very much, just as I expected it to. I really do not get the knee jerk "Learnet Pottering is bad crowd". systemd is a real blessing when you have to manually manage services the way you do with Arch and PulseAudio and pavucontrol are a real blessing when handling the volume of multiple applications or if you are using a headset.

Moving on, I also honestly do not get why anyone could hate on NetworkManger if you want a dynamic and responsive interface to handle such things. When it comes to SystemConfig though it is mostly that I am used to it after using Fedora for six years, but it does generally work and my printer works with it perfectly. The main thing I am missing on Arch is system-config-firewall.

Speaking of which, if there is one thing that is not working perfectly, it is iptables:

[root@Griffindor ~]# systemctl start iptables
Job for iptables.service failed. See 'systemctl status iptables.service' and 'journalctl -xn' for details.
[root@Griffindor ~]# systemctl status iptables.service
iptables.service - Packet Filtering Framework
Loaded: loaded (/usr/lib/systemd/system/iptables.service; disabled)
Active: failed (Result: exit-code) since Sat 2013-02-16 12:04:53 MST; 14s ago
Process: 22904 ExecStart=/usr/sbin/iptables-restore /etc/iptables/iptables.rules (code=exited, status=1/FAILURE)

Feb 16 12:04:53 Griffindor systemd[1]: Starting Packet Filtering Framework...
Feb 16 12:04:53 Griffindor systemd[1]: iptables.service: main process exite...RE
Feb 16 12:04:53 Griffindor systemd[1]: Failed to start Packet Filtering Fra...k.
Feb 16 12:04:53 Griffindor systemd[1]: Unit iptables.service entered failed...te
Feb 16 12:04:53 Griffindor iptables-restore[22904]: Can't open /etc/iptables/...
[root@Griffindor ~]#

So if you actually want to be helpful and stop shooting your mouths off you can actually help me figure that one out.

[Ericg]

Well, I recently switched to Arch and setup systemd, NetworkManager, PulseAudio, system-config-printer, as well as numerous other projects Red Hat has touched or otherwise been directly involved in. So one definitely does not need to run a Red Hat distribution to feel their effect on our ecosystem.

I wish Arch packaged more of the SystemConfig suite though:
http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/SystemConfig

I've got the exact same setup and everything works perfectly. The only issue I have is NetworkManager and either my wireless card/router dont play nice (occasional silent disconnects).

So, no, we dont "like to be punished," we dont "like hot pokers," just because you two dont like the software or its ideas/design doesn't make it bad software.

And if either one of you goes and jumps at "PulseAudio has lag! It broke my sound setup 3 years ago!" then you guys are idiots. Software has bugs. Live with it. Bugs get fixed, software improves. I haven't had a single issue with Pulse in about 2 years now,.

Yes, Pulse has some lag if you're trying to get under 10ms latency, but its not designed for the pro users who want under 10ms latency. You want pro-level audio? Try JACK or JACK2, thats software for you guys. Pulse is the solution for the 'usual' use cases. (last I checked dmix-- which was about a year ago-- is still a mess if you want headphone support and you still cant move streams between audio outputs which is important if you have a home theater setup like I do)

Systemd? No problems since early Fedora 17.

Networkmanager? Aside from the problem above, it works perfectly.

System-config-printer? Meh, I prefer the KDE KCM for printing but to each their own.