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Asahi Linux To Users: Please Stop Using X.Org

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  • #61
    Perhaps people with poor Wayland experiences are running older releases? Nvidia graphics?
    I noticed that the experience is much better, as in completely stable, smoother, and all-around-fundamentally better by design than using Xorg.
    When using recent releases.

    Install RHEL on this same computer and I have to use Gnome because the available release of KDE in EPEL is awful on Wayland and released nearly a year ago.
    Now my workstation behaves like a tablet and at that point I don't have the ideological desire to argue against Xorg: I have work to do. (Solved in 9.2 w/EPELNext)

    My point is, when you have new technology under active development and you're sitting on an iteration 12 months in the past, perhaps we should consider the use case of our system and adjust our expectations before we so boldly proclaim that "its ass". Do I want my personal-for-fun system to run Ubuntu 20.04 and expect that its KDE Wayland experience be amazing? Do I want my development workstation to be running the bleeding-est-edge software imaginable and expect that it be completely stable?

    KDE is fantastic on Wayland at (at least) 5.27.x. Wayland is the future. Let X11 die the death it deserves.

    I am actively using pure Wayland/KDE/GDM environments on all my graphical systems and the experience is more pleasurable overall than X11 has ever been.

    And, it's open source! If it's ass, fix it!


    • #62
      Originally posted by Venemo View Post
      I just came here to say that I'm very proud of the Asahi Linux developers for daring to voice this opinion.
      all hail the 🦀


      • #63
        Originally posted by michaelo2 View Post
        If the most used paid enterprise distribution has deprecated and announced that will remove in future releases (RHEL10 in 2025?), what can one expect from Asahi that are working on cutting edge technology.
        Uhhh... RHEL is the most paid enterprise distribution for reasons that have nothing to do with what windowing system they're using. RHEL is a paid distro for servers and people who need to get work done. That's far removed from the newbie desktop bros screaming "muh performance" in this thread, talking about ridiculously inconsequential crap like screen tearing. Even if a corporation is paying for RHEL desktop licenses, noone cares about all these piddling performance issues. They've got terminals and browsers open.

        Guys, just stop, really. This level of conversation is best left to conversations on Reddit over whether Sega or Nintendo was better in the 90s.


        • #64
          Originally posted by vivnet View Post
          And, it's open source! If it's ass, fix it!
          And have your patch intentionally rejected because it goes against their hysterical design (disallowing a lot of useful features in name of "privacy" or "security").


          • #65
            Just because they don't take it upstream doesn't mean you can't use it. There's a ton of crap I do for work that can never be forwarded to the world, just the way doing business is sometimes.


            • #66
              Originally posted by sophisticles View Post
              And once again, by putting Asahi on the Mac, you lose access to what may to some be worth the extra money, namely the hardware accelerators.
              Don't forget the other obvious advantage: the OS. You can stan for Linux all you want, and hate Apple as a corporation all you want, but it is certified UNIX, and Linux is not ;-) It may not be your cup of tea, but it's not a piece of garbage. Why you'd replace MacOS with Linux on one of these expensive, locked-in ecosystem machines in the first place is beyond me.

              (Note: I'm not saying people SHOULDN'T port Linux to them, or run it if they want to... people do things for lots of reasons that I'll never grok, and people should be creative in the ways they want to. I'm just sayin...)


              • #67
                Originally posted by Weasel View Post
                And have your patch intentionally rejected because it goes against their hysterical design (disallowing a lot of useful features in name of "privacy" or "security").
                Like being forced to build your house first, then having the building inspector have you tear-down your house because the inspector doesn't like your idea.

                The ideology of nowadays git community is, submit a pull request as a substitute for reasonably talking about an idea first. One big reason I miss CVS/Subversion.


                • #68
                  This is not necessarily a message for users, it's to desktop developers to make the transition from Xorg to Wayland. As a Xfce user how I migrate to Wayland? Telling users to make the transition themselves it's pointless, users want things to work, if Xorg with all imperfections works and Wayland with all perfections doesn't for what they want, they wil continue using Xorg, until the developers bring the solution or declare that particular feature it's not suitable for Wayland development model
                  ​​​​.... developers developers, please make the transition from Xorg to Wayland!


                  • #69
                    I tried giving Wayland a try last week on Ubuntu 22.04, and everything worked fine except Beyond All Reason, which crashes after a minute or so. This is on a hybrid laptop with nVidia.
                    I guess Wayland itself is mature now. The problem is that apps are still behind in terms of adoption.


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by mercster View Post

                      Why you'd replace MacOS with Linux on one of these expensive, locked-in ecosystem machines in the first place is beyond me.
                      I personally use a MacBook Air while in the field because it's light, wont overheat, long battery life, and high quality. And while I still use MacOS on that machine, there will come a day when Apple decides to leave the machine in the past, and at that time I will more than gladly be looking to install Linux directly on the hardware. The development environment is easier to keep sane anyway.

                      I believe this to be that reason.