Microsoft Reworks The "DXGKRNL" Driver It Wants To Get Into The Linux Kernel

[Quackdoc]

That won't happen until the kernel has a more stable ABI. IMHO, that should be the LTS releases. Let the stable, interim, releases break things with new drivers and changes, but have it all get back in line by the end of the year and the next LTS release.

For the love of God don't any of y'all reply to this in full. There was too much text the first time

while I agree with a lot of what's said here. IMO is misses the biggest part. Devs who don't think about the "common" user want a "run" dialog on windows? super+ R, want it on linux, ALT + f2, or alt + space, (the latter is more annoying than anything else).

The two biggest DEs are a shit show, Gnome still needs you to do stupid shit like enter cmd commands to enable fractional scaling, and has three seperate bloody applications for managing the desktop.

KDE is no better, OOB kde IMO is terrible too, the looks IMO ain't great, almost none of the default apps are consistent yet, and It just feels overall more buggy.

and I can go on and on with almost every DE. But the issues don't stop there

There are distros that by default, do incredibly stupid shit, like blacklisting broadcom drivers. Im sure a first time linux user will have a blast when that happens.

[Quackdoc]

And this is completely false.

Whatever you say pal

[ssokolow]

I think seeing EEE as a possibility here is rather dumb. Linux is GPL. If they actually extend, they are mandated to release the source code.

I think the "extend" phase is things like WSLg. "Extending" the Linux kernel by providing a VM so comfortable that Windows has the competitive advantage of doing everything Linux does for the target demographic on any given day, plus everything Windows does.

How are you supposed to compete with someone who gains whatever you add the same day you add it, but not vice-versa?

KDE is no better, [...] almost none of the default apps are consistent yet

As opposed to what? Microsoft, with its massive budgets to hire programmers, seems to have even more trouble with keeping things consistent.

As for the rest of what you said about it, emphasis on the "IMO". I don't find it buggy or ugly.

[mSparks]

reasonably sure you cant get things into the kernel that require closed sourced blobs.

whats the non windows use case for WSL?

[sinepgib]

I think the "extend" phase is things like WSLg. "Extending" the Linux kernel by providing a VM so comfortable that Windows has the competitive advantage of doing everything Linux does for the target demographic on any given day, plus everything Windows does.

How are you supposed to compete with someone who gains whatever you add the same day you add it, but not vice-versa?

That is not what EEE means. EEE means they finally take away the choice of using the alternative by making __incompatible__ or virtually impossible to implement extensions. Those changes you mean change __nothing__ for those who would rather not use MS products, and that's a huuuuge difference.
Besides, that train already shipped. Whether they need to maintain the driver out-of-tree or not, they already wrote it, they already have WSL2 there, it's done.

[ssokolow]

That is not what EEE means. EEE means they finally take away the choice of using the alternative by making __incompatible__ or virtually impossible to implement extensions. Those changes you mean change __nothing__ for those who would rather not use MS products, and that's a huuuuge difference.
Besides, that train already shipped. Whether they need to maintain the driver out-of-tree or not, they already wrote it, they already have WSL2 there, it's done.

Well, that side is obvious. Look at what a pain it is to get some devices to work on UEFI because the manufacturers only test with Windows and things like turning off Secure Boot or loading your own keys are broken. Heck, my mother's laptop refuses to boot anything but Windows off a hard drive in legacy mode because, for some reason, it only recognizes non-Windows boot sectors on removable media.

I'd say that Microsoft has modified their strategy and taken a more long-game view, but the essence of EEE is still in their corporate culture.

[Quackdoc]

reasonably sure you cant get things into the kernel that require closed sourced blobs.

whats the non windows use case for WSL?

the entire point of what I'm seeing is that this rework is explicitly designed so it doesn't require closed source inside of linux, I mean outside sure. but not inside.

[mSparks]

the entire point of what I'm seeing is that this rework is explicitly designed so it doesn't require closed source inside of linux, I mean outside sure. but not inside.

it still also needs an OSS use case. AFAIK If it cant be run/tested and useful on 100% GPL, its not suitable for inclusion.

So as long as it requires closed source software like windows to be useful its never going to get in.

[Quackdoc]

it still also needs an OSS use case. AFAIK If it cant be run/tested and useful on 100% GPL, its not suitable for inclusion.

So as long as it requires closed source software like windows to be useful its never going to get in.

I disagree, as I have stated, I believe hyper-v to be a perfectly apt hypervisor, I think this will be beneficial for those usecases. like it or not, windows is here to stay, the more people who have a favorable experience with linux, the better. linux has a lot of code inside of it that isn't useful on 100% GPL.

[mSparks]

I disagree, as I have stated, I believe hyper-v to be a perfectly apt hypervisor, I think this will be beneficial for those usecases. like it or not, windows is here to stay, the more people who have a favorable experience with linux, the better. linux has a lot of code inside of it that isn't useful on 100% GPL.

Like it or not, MS wont get special treatment, and lots of vendors that have tried to make open source code that is only useful when used in conjunction with closed sourced blobs have been turned away over the years. There was one just the other week or so, I forget who, they were about as interesting as anything MS makes (have MS even made anything new in the last 30 years, or are they still on the NT kernel + NTFS from 1995?).

Not even NVidia have managed it, and they have been trying a lot longer than MS with a much greater need in the community.