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Originally posted by tildearrow
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Actually it would be perfectly possible in Wayland, you would just have to implement it as a compositor extension instead -
"Wayland" is not removing anything, this is (or rather should be) a compositor feature, not a protocol feature. Gnome does the same thing as MacOS here, it implements a permissions system.Originally posted by tildearrow View PostComment
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A trivial example for why this is needed is controlling the volume of a music player independent from the system's master volume - which is obviously kind of important if you're trying to turn the music down so that you can hear something else. (Or for that matter, even just being able to pause the music player so you can watch a video, etc).Originally posted by tildearrow View Post
I'm getting really tired of security theater in general, but Wayland seems to be far more obsessed with it than I realised. It's amazing how even 13 years in there are so many basic things like this, or the vsync thread linked earlier, that either haven't been considered *at all* even though they were well-known concerns before the project even started; or where the only position Wayland has reached so far is either "We have no idea, maybe an extension or something?" or "Yeah, that's not going to work at all because of bad decisions made 10 years ago that our pride won't let us recover from".
I thought Wayland had finally made it to "a couple of years away" from being ready, but it's still not even 5 years from that: it's just nowhere at all other than the "toy demo" stage. It looks like at best we're going to be depending on XWayland for a VERY long time still for everything except the smartphone-style approach of "only one GUI program running at a time", or maybe one per workspace, or something like that.
Still, that won't stop the fanboys from proclaiming it the Second Coming, so at least we'll have plenty of entertainment while we wait. :PComment
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IIRC, it's because it would require a major re-architecting of their compositor.Originally posted by tildearrow View PostComment
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The explanation I was given is that Mutter for Wayland launches Mutter for X11 as a child inside XWayland, and that's what's architecturally capable of drawing SSDs.Originally posted by tildearrow View PostComment
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Gnome became the "cool kid who don't want to play with his old friends". They do what they want as they want. They had CSD on their UI Design, they kept it. And why not... The visual result is coherent and compatible with Wayland vision.Originally posted by tildearrow View Post
Today, if a protocol is needed, after being validated a first time (is it useful, well written,...) it goes to unstable protocols. And that's it, wayland compositors can implement it, and clients checking for it and using it if implemented. Later, after some time using it, it will be stabilized.
Wlroots is a great compositor library, not rebuilt from Xorg roots like Mutter or [KDE compositor's name]. It is far easier for it to implement new protocols. A "global cursor position" protocol would be easy to implement into it (but needs the last thing missing into compositors to achieve Wayland's vision : indicators or security popups to indicate/allow an app to use a protocol).
It seems to be long (quality takes time), but when things will be done, you'll see a very few implementations (mutter, wlroots, and some specific compositors), with this stabilisation X11 will be able to finally die after a long and full life (and XWayland will be kept for compatibility reasons).Comment
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Wayland is useless garbage. I haven't actually used it, but I've read that people have issues with it. Feature X (which I don't use either) has worked in X.org for 20 years, but is missing from Wayland. I'm not going to write a protocol for it, because I don't need it + I don't know how to program. I don't care that the entire industry already moved on a long time ago and that X is completely and utterly dead either. Although I'm obviously completely incompetent and clueless, I strongly feel the need to bitch and complain about some of it's design decisions because my sound card doesn't work with PipeWire. Wayland really sucks because Linux is monolithic + Redhat is evil and systemd is bloated and binary only. I went off topic on purpose because I felt this discussion could not continue without my uneducated opinions. PS Gnome/KDE is trash, XFCE is the perfect desktop everybody on the planet should use because.
Pretty much sums up the average Phoronix user
Last edited by arokh; 03 August 2021, 10:25 AM.Comment
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Originally posted by arokh View PostWayland is useless garbage. I haven't actually used it, but I've read that people have issues with it. Feature X (which I don't use either) has worked in X.org for 20 years, but is missing from Wayland. I'm not going to write a protocol for it, because I don't need it + I don't know how to program. I don't care that the entire industry already moved on a long time ago and that X is completely and utterly dead either. Although I'm obviously completely incompetent and clueless, I strongly feel the need to bitch and complain about some of it's design decisions because my sound card doesn't work with PipeWire. Wayland really sucks because Linux is monolithic + Redhat is evil and systemd is bloated and binary only. I went off topic on purpose because I felt this discussion could not continue without my uneducated opinions. PS Gnome/KDE is trash, XFCE is the perfect desktop everybody on the planet should use because.
Pretty much sums up the average Phoronix user
*wobbles* *dabs*Comment
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The background image says like "Save nature and the planet!" and the window system says "Fuck that! Lets produce more CO2 with useless effects."Originally posted by AHOY View PostComment
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