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A Look Back At The Desktop & X.Org/Wayland/Mir Milestones Of Ubuntu

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Delgarde View Post

    On the contrary - if I'm reaching for a mouse at all, efficiency is already wasted. On both Windows 7 and Gnome 3, I work exactly the same way - hit the Windows key, and type the first couple of letters of the program name. Far easier than taking hands off the keyboard to navigate menu hierarchies...
    What are you talking about?
    I use Windows 7 most of the time and I have shortcuts on the desktop of all the programs that I use frequently.
    It's really easy and very fast to open every program that I want using the mouse.
    I don't think you can beat me in efficiency by pressing the windows key an typing a few letters.
    And what's the point of searching for a program every time you want to use it?
    I use the keyboard only if I want to use a program that I don't frequently use and I need to search for it.
    I find it more logical an efficient to to put a frequently used program's shorcut on desktop or taskbar.
    But I get it, Gnome 3 is so advanced that it doesn't allows you to do that, it's not the "Gnome 3" way.

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    • #32
      I don't see nothing wrong with this Desktop metaphor approach even today Panel, start button, icons on Desktop, console, web browser, file manager... fine to me


      Why i like this also is that majority of people are already familiar with this metaphor and you don't need to go around and to change peoples mind

      And i mean The Desktop, not special devices even laptops someone wanna be like a tablet, tablet like a laptop, phone as Desktop, Desktop as phone, tablet as phone, embeded as phoned Desktop, etc ... shit only became true when people push this kind of convergance to solve all the problems, it is impossible to solve all that with one hit
      Last edited by dungeon; 06 April 2017, 07:24 AM.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Danny3 View Post

        What are you talking about?
        I use Windows 7 most of the time and I have shortcuts on the desktop of all the programs that I use frequently.
        It's really easy and very fast to open every program that I want using the mouse.
        I don't think you can beat me in efficiency by pressing the windows key an typing a few letters.
        And what's the point of searching for a program every time you want to use it?
        I use the keyboard only if I want to use a program that I don't frequently use and I need to search for it.
        I find it more logical an efficient to to put a frequently used program's shorcut on desktop or taskbar.
        But I get it, Gnome 3 is so advanced that it doesn't allows you to do that, it's not the "Gnome 3" way.
        He's talking about the fact the mouse can only issue one command per second (or so) at most. Using the keyboard, if you know your shortcuts, you can easily triple that. It's why there's no mouse support in Street Fighter or Tekken

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Qaridarium
          Flatpak and snappy is next... Please make a desicion what the Standard should be...
          And AppImage You don't make something standard, but standard makes itself by success rate.

          Standards are defined by Microsoft and Google majorly EXE and APK Basically any company is free to define their standards, so you push something and if it succeed that became the standard, whatever that is

          we do Not need multiple solution For the same Problem
          That is impossible Imagine we start that right from the Linux kernel itself, one official upstream kernel build for all distros around Problem solved isn't it? That way we will have GPU drivers from all the vendors let alone AMD blob even VIA or any really or you have problem with that

          He, he, but that is the main feature of opensource and GNU/Linux Forking things and adopting things as you need/like is its main feature.
          Last edited by dungeon; 06 April 2017, 07:29 AM.

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          • #35
            I dont get it, why permanently someone is trying so declare this or that DE dead or sh*t. Gnome is widely used, and so is Unity. Canonical stops Unity because it was made for convergence, and therefore for mobile devices. But mobile devices with Ubuntu do not stand a chance. Not because Ubuntu or Mir or Unity is bad, but because the whole mobile market is f*cked up. No small firm can compete there, and even less, if there is no open hardware, and too few user demanding it. And even big guy MS cant make a stand, there. And at some point, Canonical was too optimistic about the market environment, just like Jolla and others. So - no niche for Ubuntu phone: therefore no convergence, therefore no Unity and no Mir. Even if Canonical would have wanted/used Wayland, it would not been of any help for selling phones.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by sverris View Post
              I dont get it, why permanently someone is trying so declare this or that DE dead or sh*t. Gnome is widely used, and so is Unity. Canonical stops Unity because it was made for convergence, and therefore for mobile devices. But mobile devices with Ubuntu do not stand a chance. Not because Ubuntu or Mir or Unity is bad, but because the whole mobile market is f*cked up. No small firm can compete there, and even less, if there is no open hardware, and too few user demanding it. And even big guy MS cant make a stand, there. And at some point, Canonical was too optimistic about the market environment, just like Jolla and others. So - no niche for Ubuntu phone: therefore no convergence, therefore no Unity and no Mir. Even if Canonical would have wanted/used Wayland, it would not been of any help for selling phones.
              Hm, you'd think that if Unity was to be used on the desktop (among other things), it would be capable to stand on its own, regardless of the mobile situation.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by phoronix
                So with that, Unity 8 (and presumably Mir) and Ubuntu Phone go the way of Ubuntu TV, Ubuntu for Android, Upstart, Ubuntu One, etc. It will be interesting to see where Ubuntu focuses on next
                They plan to do a project and then to discontinue it, like all they already done.
                Canonical is motivated by money, not by his community.

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Trevelyan View Post
                  Wayland != Weston/LibWeston != Kwin/QT != Mutter/GTK != Enlightenment/ELF

                  Wayland is a protocol definition, and not code in any language. So no C vs. C++ vs. ObjC vs. C#

                  Weston is a Wayland compositor implemented in C built on LibWeston. LibWeston (C code) could be reused by other Wayland compositors, but is _not_ used by the "big 3".

                  KWin is a Wayland compositor implemented in C++ built on QT/KDE-Foundations. i.e. Object Orientated

                  Mutter is a Wayland compositor implemented in (I assume) C built on GTK

                  E's compositor is also (I assume) implemented in C built on EFL

                  The are other compositor implementations, even in other OO languages, but I believe most of the smaller outfits eventually use LibWeston or QT's compositor lib.

                  NOTE: There is no "Wayland Server" (like X11 has) that the compositors connect or speak with. Clients connected directly to the compositor via the wayland protocol and the compositor has to deal with Input and Output hardware all on its own. (Usually via LibInput and GBM/DRI/EGL)
                  I was very clear and wrote about "Wayland implementations". Out of the 4 you mentioned only KWin is based on C++ and I think it targets the specific needs of KDE. Anyway, IMO this development is a great opportunity for someone to fork Mir and make it "talk" the Wayland protocol!
                  Last edited by zoomblab; 06 April 2017, 08:58 AM.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Trevelyan View Post
                    Wayland is a protocol definition, and not code in any language. So no C vs. C++ vs. ObjC vs. C#
                    Not true, Wayland provides client and server libraries (libwayland-client and libwayland-server, respectively) written in C. These allow applications and compositors to avoid having to interact with the protocol directly, instead accessing it through ordinary library calls.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Delgarde View Post
                      As such, I love Gnome 3, because it has better keyboard support than any other mainstream desktop... which is also why I think people are crazy when they describe it as a tablet-UI optimised for touch-screens.
                      What can you do with a keyboard in Gnome 3 that you can't do in Plasma 5?

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