Wayland's Wild 2024 With Better KDE Plasma Support, NVIDIA Maturity & More Desktops

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  • varikonniemi
    Senior Member
    • Jan 2012
    • 1102

    #21
    Originally posted by mrg666 View Post
    I have been on Wayland since 3 years now. And X11 is not even installed since one year. I think Wayland has been one of the best things happened to Linux, maybe along with systemd. I hope it does not overstay like X11. I welcome the continuing development; it should evolve unlike X11 that stayed the same for decades. Linux is breaking away from all of the UNIX chains one by one.
    at this point there is no major change on the horizon, wayland already uses the best practices and technologies available in Linux. In fact this is exactly why it took some time to implement it, because the design was what's technically best, no matter how much it breaks current paradigm.

    Yes, when all the wayland extensions etc. get standardized and stabilized and some quirks agreed upon how to fix, there may come a wayland 2 spec that has all that. But in reality it's just a minor protocol/definition/extension update&standardization.

    AFAIK there are only some minor issues in the protocol specification that would need a "wayland 2" But they might be so minor that it is not even worth fixing them instead of working around them, and just ride the current wayland spec for the next decade.
    Last edited by varikonniemi; 31 December 2024, 05:47 PM.

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    • ezst036
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2018
      • 680

      #22
      Originally posted by mikoskinen View Post
      Googling seems to indicate that the bad performance on external monitor with KDE & Wayland & Nvidia is a common issue. But I haven't found any solutions that help.
      Buy a cheapy AMD card and just give it a try for a while. Most people's so-called Wayland issues are not Wayland issues at all.

      They are Nvidia issues. either an intel or an AMD is your solution.

      I am not advocating you give up Nvidia altogether. I'm just saying, you'll see if you can A/B compare. Wayland has worked great for years and years and y​​​​​​ears.

      Nvidia is the problem. Nvidia has always been the problem.
      Last edited by ezst036; 31 December 2024, 06:07 PM.

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      • wertigon
        Senior Member
        • Jan 2020
        • 301

        #23
        Originally posted by Weasel View Post
        What parity to X11?

        You still can't query absolute window positions from a generic bash script that works on all compositors
        First, why would you ever want that? Window placement is the responsibility of the compositior not the display protocol (dp task is just sending window buffers to the right place). You are asking the police to respond to medical emergencies, maybe the sheriff in your town did work overtime as an ambulance driver but that is not how it works anywhere else.
        ​​​
        Second, wayland is not all of X, by design. You dont like it, start maintaining X. The rest of us are walking away from that garbage for a reason.

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        • rob-tech
          Phoronix Member
          • Jul 2022
          • 85

          #24
          With so many basic things such as colour management not fully implemented, I wouldn't call the Wayland KDE session at parity to the X11 one. Maybe it's suitable for the basic user/gamer, however, there are so many workloads that make it unusable.

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          • andyprough
            Senior Member
            • Feb 2012
            • 2452

            #25
            Originally posted by ezst036 View Post
            Wayland has worked great for years and years and y​​​​​​ears.
            There are some people who live their entire lives inside a Google Chrome browser instance. For those people, maybe you could say wayland has worked acceptably for year(s). But not "years and years and years" - that would imply at least 6 years, which is clearly not true.

            But for anyone who has to work with complex content creation of audio+video, or has to stream content, or even anyone who has to regularly host online meetings, wayland has not been up to the task at all. It may be that just within the past few months that some of the bigger issues in content creation/streaming/sharing may have been worked out, I'm not sure. I doubt it, but I'll find out soon enough when I try it again this year.

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            • Gusar
              Senior Member
              • Feb 2012
              • 1337

              #26
              Originally posted by wertigon View Post
              why would you ever want that?
              This right here is why many people aren't switching to Wayland.

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              • ezst036
                Senior Member
                • Feb 2018
                • 680

                #27
                Originally posted by andyprough View Post
                There are some people who live their entire lives inside a Google Chrome browser instance. For those people, maybe you could say wayland has worked acceptably for year(s). But not "years and years and years" - that would imply at least 6 years, which is clearly not true.

                But for anyone who has to work with complex content creation of audio+video, or has to stream content, or even anyone who has to regularly host online meetings, wayland has not been up to the task at all. It may be that just within the past few months that some of the bigger issues in content creation/streaming/sharing may have been worked out, I'm not sure. I doubt it, but I'll find out soon enough when I try it again this year.​
                Clearly you own an Nvidia card and are shifting the blame. That is to be expected, it happens all the time from the Nvidia crowd.
                Last edited by ezst036; 31 December 2024, 10:00 PM.

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                • andyprough
                  Senior Member
                  • Feb 2012
                  • 2452

                  #28
                  Originally posted by ezst036 View Post

                  Clearly you own an Nvidia card and are shifting the blame. That is to be expected, it happens all the time from the Nvidia crowd.
                  I've never used an nvidia card. Not interested in running non-free firmware.

                  Comment

                  • wertigon
                    Senior Member
                    • Jan 2020
                    • 301

                    #29
                    Originally posted by Gusar View Post
                    This right here is why many people aren't switching to Wayland.
                    So we should have a way to discover where a window is in the core Wayland protocol because...?

                    I am not asking why the feature should exist, I am asking why Wayland should take care of that, since Wayland has no concept of windows. The compositor handles windows.

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                    • back2未來
                      Phoronix Member
                      • Oct 2023
                      • 80

                      #30
                      Originally posted by varikonniemi View Post
                      It took some work and patience, but it certainly was worth it, wayland is by far the cleanest, most advanced protocol available.

                      The biggest enemy of wayland was the x fanatics who did not want to believe that the time had come to move on. When on several platforms you could see a watt difference in energy use just from ditching x it should be obvious how much work was being done on modern hardware just to support something designed several decades ago for hardware that has not existed for decades.
                      [ Plugging in secondary/third(/multiple?) displays on USB hubs was mostly unusable with Wayland, because it delays all screens for the whole system getting sluggish (Not on X). It improved from 20.04 on, but was still a problem with 24.04 for Ubuntu distros and 6.x Kernels (but being pretty confident, it's not about the Kernel).
                      Without additional displays the experience with Wayland (for the supported window managers: Gnome, Kde) was almost acceptable for most demand, but remote displays and configuration (UIs) for graphics; and some documentations therefore(?)

                      Best wishes for the changing years @all (thx) ]

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