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Wayland Color Management Protocol Posted For Weston

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  • #21
    Originally posted by rmfx View Post
    Just work internally as raw linear data and let OCIO configs remap the colours.
    Oh, OCIO!

    Why so few mentions about it? Even Adobe and other behemoths use it!

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    • #22
      Originally posted by timofonic View Post

      Oh, OCIO!

      Why so few mentions about it? Even Adobe and other behemoths use it!
      it does *everything* on shaders or cpu, which can add a load of overhead. im not sure it's suited for a desktop environment for daily use, maybe as an option enhanced colormanagement option?

      it's probably not super expensive but it is overhead

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      • #23
        Originally posted by Quackdoc View Post

        it does *everything* on shaders or cpu, which can add a load of overhead. im not sure it's suited for a desktop environment for daily use, maybe as an option enhanced colormanagement option?

        it's probably not super expensive but it is overhead
        Isn't what most apps use these days? CPU or GPU :P

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        • #24
          i'm not worried about HDR support until there's some good HDR monitors that don't suffer burn-in or blooming artifacts. But I suspect we'll all own microled monitors before linux sorts this out.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by Berniyh View Post
            I don't think it'll take that long, at least not for AMD with the open source drivers.
            The way I understood it is that the kernel side is basically ready for HDR and we're mainly waiting for support in compositors and applications, which is what this protocol is part of.
            This seems like a realistic scenario, since under some circumstances (i.e. with gamescope), you can already run some games in HDR.

            So if the protocols are set, which hopefully happens sooner than later, then there is light at the end of the virtual tunnel … in HDR.
            It will take a lot longer, because even when they finally get a reference implementation out, the desktop environments still need to adopt it, and the way things have been going with say screen recording, they will all do it differently and broken to varying degrees for a long, long time to come.

            IBM sent the message loud and proud. If you are using a Linux PC in any kind of professional manner, steer clear of fedora and redhat, they are just for tinkerers and executives that still believe in "no one was ever fired for choosing IBM".

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            • #26
              Originally posted by mSparks View Post
              It will take a lot longer, because even when they finally get a reference implementation out, the desktop environments still need to adopt it, and the way things have been going with say screen recording, they will all do it differently and broken to varying degrees for a long, long time to come.
              Not the same. Screen Recording requires alterations on application code side. This Color Management most applications will not be changing anything. Instead this will be like in colord that is already middle ware between application and graphics.

              Also lets not forget X11 Color management is some-work works under X11 only if you are using Intel or AMD and that you are totally in trouble with Nvidia because many applications that support color management will not work with Nvidia because they need colord that sends everything insane.

              This is area that could be way better under Wayland very quickly.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by Errinwright View Post
                Does this clash with Melissa's work on HDR- and colour management?
                TL;DR: It doesn't.

                A compositor implementation of the colour management protocol doesn't require any new KMS API for colour transformations. It can use shaders for that, which is needed anyway as a fallback if any KMS colour transformation functionality can't be used for some reason. The shader-based fallback normally needs to be implemented first anyway.

                (Melissa's fine work is mainly for the Steam Deck. Its KMS UAPI is specific to AMD hardware and won't be available to user space in upstream kernels. General purpose compositors will instead use the vendor-neutral KMS UAPI which is being worked on, as an optimization over the shader-based fallback)​

                Originally posted by Quackdoc View Post

                this hardly scratches the surface, IMO the only viable solution is what mac has, which is a fully managed pipeline, the compositor should do things like gamut mapping and tonemapping when possible
                That's the plan for Wayland. The colour management Wayland protocol is a core part of it.​

                Originally posted by smitty3268 View Post

                I think Red Hat expects professionals to be using RHEL, which is sticking with X for the near future.
                Xorg is deprecated in RHEL 9 (i.e. to be removed from a future major version of RHEL), it defaults to Wayland except for some setups with Nvidia GPUs.

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by oiaohm View Post

                  This is area that could be way better under Wayland very quickly.


                  Well, you'd think so, but it has so far taken 15 years and it doesn't even have basic colour settings working, they are really going to need to up the game if it isn't going to take another 15 years to get this more advanced stuff into the desktop environments, colour is a lot more complex than you seem to think.

                  Originally posted by MrCooper View Post

                  Xorg is deprecated in RHEL 9
                  OpenELA sets the standards for enterprise Linux now. They will have to get the community to vote on it if they want to depreciate anything.
                  Last edited by mSparks; 25 September 2023, 05:08 AM.

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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by Sethox View Post

                    Depends in what space, Valve has Gamescope that already supports HDR. With Wine Wayland being developed steadily, I believe that will also grant for HDR support one way or another. Still years off is a little bit much although it's all just assumptions.
                    Games don't really care about color-accurate-anything and the compositor can only take care of ASSUMING the color space of the user space, meaning it can only take care of sRGB content. Trust me, it won't happen overnight: too many applications still don't support color management under X11.
                    ## VGA ##
                    AMD: X1950XTX, HD3870, HD5870
                    Intel: GMA45, HD3000 (Core i5 2500K)

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by mSparks View Post
                      ​OpenELA sets the standards for enterprise Linux now. They will have to get the community to vote on it if they want to depreciate anything.
                      All the distrobutions that make up OpenELA is default wayland. Yes Orcale and SUSE is default Wayland Just like RHEL.

                      No OpenELA does not promise community vote.

                      https://openela.org/news/hello_world/ Yes Oracle/Suse deciding to work with CIQ. All three see Wayland as the way forwards.

                      Yes all OpenELA is that you can still legally get your mits on RHEL equivalent sources.

                      Horrible newest current OpenELA design is RHEL deprecates something OpenELA in future will also deprecate it. “OpenELA is our response to this need, and it represents a commitment to helping the open source community continue to develop compatible EL distributions.”​ Yes EL distributions as one to one to RHEL.

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