libdisplay-info Started To Address The Wayland Fragmentation Around EDID/DisplayID

[caligula]

It is Kde and Gnome who refuses to share their implementation.

Not that easy to make C++/Qt/MOC/cmake stuff compatible with C/GTK/GLIB/Vala/autohell.

[ResponseWriter]

I though wlroots was supposed to address some of the fragmentation but maybe not this part. Anyway, my main complaint about wayland right now is how wayland clients get disconnected if there's a bit of IO slowing things down, which sometimes happens to me multiple times per day, and how wayland developers seem to be very slow in responding to merge requests. Right now I'm running wayland-git with a patch from one of the merge requests which thankfully seems to have almost resolved the issue for me although it's not the best, erm.. Long-term solution.

[birdie]

Yes, there are multiple implementations if you check the Wikipedia, though it is true that on Linux, you mostly use the X.Org one.

And you can see here it isn't a protocol problem, it is an implementation problem.

It is Kde and Gnome who refuses to share their implementation.

And Wayland actually has an official implementation called Weston https://github.com/wayland-project/weston and they also provides libweston as a lib, but Kde and Gnome just refuses to use it, or contribute to it if it is not yet good enough.

The fuck should anyone care about dead implementations no one uses?

Maybe let's go back to the history of computing and find some extra faults over there?

Stop shoving Weston where light doesn't shine, OK? Can I use this Crapston with KDE? Gnome? My XFCE? Does it even have a task panel?

No? I'm talking about what we have right fucking now. Right fucking now we have a zoo of Wayland implementations which copy literally tens of thousands of lines of code reimplementing the same stuff over and over again. This is fucking madness.

There's something horribly wrong about people who try to defend this abomination while trying to talk about fucking Wikipedia page about the crap no one cares about. This shows how horribly wrong the whole situation is.

[birdie]

I though wlroots was supposed to address some of the fragmentation but maybe not this part. Anyway, my main complaint about wayland right now is how wayland clients get disconnected if there's a bit of IO slowing things down, which sometimes happens to me multiple times per day, and how wayland developers seem to be very slow in responding to merge requests. Right now I'm running wayland-git with a patch from one of the merge requests which thankfully seems to have almost resolved the issue for me although it's not the best, erm.. Long-term solution.

wlroots is not even a library per se. Nothing in my Fedora requires or uses it. It's a fucking pile of code Wayland developers couldn't care less about. And I've not heard of Gnome or KDE or anything else intending to use it. "Here, we have a library. It sorta could solve something. We believe so. Oh, no one actually uses it? Oh, crap."

[NobodyXu]

The fuck should anyone care about dead implementations no one uses?

Maybe let's go back to the history of computing and find some extra faults over there?

Stop shoving Weston where light doesn't shine, OK? Can I use this Crapston with KDE? Gnome? My XFCE? Does it even have a task panel?

No? I'm talking about what we have right fucking now. Right fucking now we have a zoo of Wayland implementations which copy literally tens of thousands of lines of code reimplementing the same stuff over and over again. This is fucking madness.

There's something horribly wrong about people who try to defend this abomination while trying to talk about fucking Wikipedia page about the crap no one cares about. This shows how horribly wrong the whole situation is.

I am not defending the situation, I am saying that you should not blame the Wayland protocol for this.

It is Kde and Gnome to blame, since they refuses to cooperate with each other.

Weston is an official implementation, and it provides a dynamic library, that Kde and Gnome can use to implement their Wayland compositor:

Libweston is an effort to separate the re-usable parts of Weston into a library. Libweston provides most of the boring and tedious bits of correctly implementing core Wayland protocols and interfacing with input and output systems, so that people who just want to write a new “Wayland window manager” (WM) or a small desktop environment (DE) can focus on the WM part.

And it is Kde and Gnome that refuses to use libweston.

[NobodyXu]

Not that easy to make C++/Qt/MOC/cmake stuff compatible with C/GTK/GLIB/Vala/autohell.

That is definitely true for Kde.

So I can understand that Kde and Gnome developers decide to come up with their own implementation that fits their own codebase, but duplicating everything sure isn't a good engineering practice.

[ehansin]

wlroots is not even a library per se. Nothing in my Fedora requires or uses it. It's a fucking pile of code Wayland developers couldn't care less about. And I've not heard of Gnome or KDE or anything else intending to use it. "Here, we have a library. It sorta could solve something. We believe so. Oh, no one actually uses it? Oh, crap."

I will say, to each their own. That said, I have been getting Sway window manager (uses wlroots) on all sorts of stuff (including Linux running as guests in VirtualBox on Windows hosts.) Now I realized I could get the Hikari window manager (also uses wlroots) to launch within a Sway window (or another vt)! Turtles all the way down I tell you, and for me seemed kind of cool.

Okay, one thing I will agree with hear. It would be nice to see more and more functionality that could be useful among various desktops, window managers, etc. broken out into individual composable (am I using this correctly here?) libraries. Heck, would be cool to have these hosted in one spot. Would reduce code duplication and create "standard" implementations, so consistency there. And if someone had better ideas, they could write a competing/replacement library, and if it turned out to be better or offer greater value, that could be migrated to.

I am no expert on the display server stuff, but I am liking that things are starting to settle some and more and more things are just working.

[NobodyXu]

wlroots is not even a library per se. Nothing in my Fedora requires or uses it. It's a fucking pile of code Wayland developers couldn't care less about. And I've not heard of Gnome or KDE or anything else intending to use it. "Here, we have a library. It sorta could solve something. We believe so. Oh, no one actually uses it? Oh, crap."

wlroots is.a library that can be reused, its repository https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/wlroots/wlroots/ explicitly mentioned that:

A modular Wayland compositor library

Pluggable, composable, unopinionated modules for building a Wayland compositor; or about 60,000 lines of code you were going to write anyway.

wlroots implements a huge variety of Wayland compositor features and implements them right, so you can focus on the features that make your compositor unique. By using wlroots, you get high performance, excellent hardware compatibility, broad support for many wayland interfaces, and comfortable development tools - or any subset of these features you like, because all of them work independently of one another and freely compose with anything you want to implement yourself

And wlroots is used by sway, a tiling windows manager, similar to i3 and dwm.

I used swaywm daily, and it is awesome and lightweight.

[wagner17]

Wayland is fragmentation. I wonder how many years will pass before someone says "enough is enough" and addresses this <del>madness</del> peculiar design choice.

Probably never. Seems pretty clear that there will be Gnome, KDE and wlroots for everybody else. Same fragmentation that has existed for 20+ years.

[Mez']

with the increasing number of different Wayland compositors out there, there is a lot of fragmentation

For me, the article could have stopped there.
Wayland, by definition, makes every DE reinvent a wheel. Contrary to X.
I´ve adopted wayland, so I´m not against it, but it should have been more of a centralized common effort than delegating and expecting every DE to have to do its own thing. Such a waste of resources.