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  • #31
    Originally posted by birdie View Post
    The fact that e.g. XFCE and LXQT don't even have plans to support Wayland due to sheer complexity of doing so doesn't bother them the slightest.
    Wow you're so disingenuous that you're gonna act like you and i have both posted the plans for XFCE to support Wayland several times before.

    https://wiki.xfce.org/releng/wayland_roadmap

    It literally says that they might just use Mutter (which the creator of XFCE now works on) or go the Wlroots route. And note that the primary reason that they wanted to maintain X11 support was the state of Nvidia drivers on Wayland. Now that Nvidia's finally supporting GBM, which would make other compositors viable for them as well.

    Plus somebody on Reddit was able to run an XFCE Wayland session this week by just swapping out XFWM with a Wayland compositor.
    https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comme..._swapping_out/


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    • #32
      Originally posted by birdie View Post
      The lead IceWM developer outright refused to support it. ).
      Are there any plans for IceWM at all?

      https://github.com/bbidulock/icewm/pulls

      https://github.com/bbidulock/icewm/graphs/contributors

      Looks like only two or three people have still been working on it over the last four years and bbidulock has no commits past February 8th, 2020.

      You're "proof" that the devs flat out refuse to support Wayland seems more like proof that nobody reads the issues anymore.

      Comment


      • #33
        Contrary to what's been said in this thread, Plasma Wayland is actually in pretty good shape. There's only the fact that Wayland windows die if they receive too much input while waiting for other io (Wayland bug, although there's a potential fix in comments), and I keep finding fullscreen windows (various games, e.g. Cities: Skylines for one) get positioned with their centre at the bottom right corner of the screen and cannot be moved. I expect these will be fixed eventually. Everything else seems pretty good since 5.23.2.

        Smaller projects can make use of the work already done in wlroots and hopefully standardise things there.
        Last edited by ResponseWriter; 30 October 2021, 07:02 AM. Reason: The Wayland io thing is a Wayland bug, not Plasma

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        • #34
          Originally posted by birdie View Post

          Is the Wayland protocol feature complete? I've seen very few people who think so outside RedHat and some staunch Wayland fans here on Phoronix who believe Gnome/Mutter is Wayland. The fact that e.g. XFCE and LXQT don't even have plans to support Wayland due to sheer complexity of doing so doesn't bother them the slightest. The lead IceWM developer outright refused to support it. The fact that KDE is struggling to work properly under Wayland is also quite telling (last time someone on Phoronix tried to run it, they discovered at least 7 criticial bugs).

          Lastly it looks like you just cannot stop with insults. This is probably the 20th time you're calling me names. And our brave, honest and impartial moderator, tildearrow will as always neglect your insults and only threaten to ban me. What a wonderful community we have here.
          OK, that's enough. Let me speak.

          I do agree with many of your points regarding Wayland and other things, but this attitude of yours is anything but helpful.
          The one who's making this community "wonderful" is you. Provoking the same bullcrap over and over.
          You seemingly cannot realize we're all tired of you, therefore you insist in doing this.
          The only accomplishment you might have done is discouraging other people from interacting on these forums as the moment you step in any serious and sane discussion is burnt to ashes and suddenly you become the focus of attention.
          I remember that day on the NVIDIA driver release thread... 180 comments... of what? The first ones were informative and on-topic, but then oh hey that's birdie and now it's about vendor support, AMD and Intel, that "open-source is a disgrace", and then a nonsense fight between X11 and Wayland. Yep, and we all forgot about the thread's topic... COMPLETELY.

          Nobody has "called you names" in a way that is off limits. You're just too sensitive.

          Yes, I am brave enough to speak out on this problem.
          Yes, I am honest enough to speak the truth about how I feel about you.
          Yes, I am impartial enough because all you're doing is taking the fun element of this community away.

          Please tell me, why can't you TAKE A BREAK and NOT RETURN with this attitude of you?!
          Oh yeah, because you like being the center of attention 'cuz it amuses you to see everyone rise up and get angry at you.

          Would you please vanish for once?

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by user1 View Post
            So let me get this straight.. On one hand, Wayland compositors have to reinvent the wheel because of the protocol's minimalism. On the other hand, that's what Wayland developers want, because they don't want to turn into a "bloated mess" like x11. Can't there be some middle ground in this situation?
            The middle ground is a fragmented chaotic mess instead of just a bloated one. And unsurprisingly, nobody seems to be very enthusiastic about that.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by birdie View Post

              Is the Wayland protocol feature complete? I've seen very few people who think so outside RedHat and some staunch Wayland fans here on Phoronix who believe Gnome/Mutter is Wayland. The fact that e.g. XFCE and LXQT don't even have plans to support Wayland due to sheer complexity of doing so doesn't bother them the slightest. The lead IceWM developer outright refused to support it. The fact that KDE is struggling to work properly under Wayland is also quite telling (last time someone on Phoronix tried to run it, they discovered at least 7 criticial bugs).

              Lastly it looks like you just cannot stop with insults. This is probably the 20th time you're calling me names. And our brave, honest and impartial moderator, tildearrow will as always neglect your insults and only threaten to ban me. What a wonderful community we have here.
              tildearrow isn't the one to make bans, I am. And he is far from the only one to be tired of your behavior in the forums. Last chance to avoid perma-ban.
              Michael Larabel
              https://www.michaellarabel.com/

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by tildearrow View Post

                OK, that's enough. Let me speak.

                I do agree with many of your points regarding Wayland and other things, but this attitude of yours is anything but helpful.
                The one who's making this community "wonderful" is you. Provoking the same bullcrap over and over.
                You seemingly cannot realize we're all tired of you, therefore you insist in doing this.
                The only accomplishment you might have done is discouraging other people from interacting on these forums as the moment you step in any serious and sane discussion is burnt to ashes and suddenly you become the focus of attention.
                I remember that day on the NVIDIA driver release thread... 180 comments... of what? The first ones were informative and on-topic, but then oh hey that's birdie and now it's about vendor support, AMD and Intel, that "open-source is a disgrace", and then a nonsense fight between X11 and Wayland. Yep, and we all forgot about the thread's topic... COMPLETELY.

                Nobody has "called you names" in a way that is off limits. You're just too sensitive.

                Yes, I am brave enough to speak out on this problem.
                Yes, I am honest enough to speak the truth about how I feel about you.
                Yes, I am impartial enough because all you're doing is taking the fun element of this community away.

                Please tell me, why can't you TAKE A BREAK and NOT RETURN with this attitude of you?!
                Oh yeah, because you like being the center of attention 'cuz it amuses you to see everyone rise up and get angry at you.

                Would you please vanish for once?
                This. All this.

                I went into the threads about the last two major Nvidia driver releases, the one that added DMA-buf support and the one that added GBM support, excited for what that means for myself as someone with an Nvidia card, for Wayland adoption, and for the Linux desktop. As usual there were some people with some beta issues and some asking people if this means a certain application or feature now works.... then comes birdie. None of those people get their questions answered because the whole topic turns into birdie saying the same things about Wayland. It's not even a continued conversation between topics. He just hits reset and act like the argument has never been had before. Anything in previous topics just didn't count. If it was out of site, it was out of mind. So even though I went in happy that Nvidia was doing the right thing, by the end of the topic he makes myself and others complain about all the bad that Nvidia has done in the last ten years.

                Comment


                • #38
                  My opinion ... wayland could have been better, less tiring for all composers, in some cases we were forced to write special APIs, as there was nothing useful.
                  So saying Wayland is saying nothing, being just a protocol, a protocol that has complicated the life of the composers who find themselves today doing what Xorg did before.
                  Certainly there was a better way in an ecosystem like gnu / linux featuring dozens of projects.
                  However, today we have this and I believe that sooner or later everyone has to get over it.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Vistaus View Post

                    Same here, but with an Intel UHD 620. But no one has any ideas here, 'cause everytime I bring this up, people don't want to know about it as Wayland is the holy grail. They never try to come up with some sort of solution or thing I could try because it supposedly should “just work” on Intel (and AMD). So don't count on help, Etherman.
                    To be honest though, saying "it doesn't work" while providing no real information on an issue with something that apparently "does work" for pretty much everybody else (which implies you're a corner case), and at the same time you're doing so not on the respective bug tracker but on a forum for random enthusiasts (who may or may not be knowledgeable enough to help you), your should probably consider receiving help as the lucky exception and not the rule.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by birdie View Post

                      Is the Wayland protocol feature complete? I've seen very few people who think so outside RedHat and some staunch Wayland fans here on Phoronix who believe Gnome/Mutter is Wayland.
                      Those are Red Hat-paid trolls.
                      They're like Russians trying to indoctrinate people enough with anything Red Hat that it ends up entering some weaklings' minds.

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