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Wayland 1.19 Released With Small Protocol Updates, Fixes

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  • #11
    Originally posted by jacob View Post

    That's not something to be implemented "for Wayland". It's a compositor feature.
    Oh yeah? Ever heard of rich APIs, no code duplication which Wayland basically forces on developers which is why we have basically just two DEs which support it fully, eg Gnome and KDE while others like IceWM has rejected to support this craziness?

    Originally posted by tildearrow View Post

    And so what? I have to write my recording/casting code 10 times now? One time for each compositor?

    And where are the permission-based global key listening features? Like to trigger hotkeys?
    But it's lean and fast and tear-free!

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    • #12
      Originally posted by birdie View Post
      The user of an OS with less than 1% desktop market share speaks!! Nvidia must be shaking in their boots at the prospect of more fan-tics choosing Intel/AMD over it.

      Sacrasm aside, wake me up when Linux on the desktop becomes an OS the average Joe and his grandma can use and which has tons of software including games.
      Really Nvidia should be worried by the trend by Linux kernel developers not to be depending on Nvidia cards as this means upstream alterations breaking Nvidia are not effecting them directly.

      The desktop market share Linux has part of that market makes the kernel Nvidia needs to be compatible with them so they can keep their sales up in the super computing market long term.

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      • #13
        Originally posted by tildearrow View Post

        And so what? I have to write my recording/casting code 10 times now? One time for each compositor?

        And where are the permission-based global key listening features? Like to trigger hotkeys?
        You don't need to write any code, it's already done. Here is but one among several:

        https://extensions.gnome.org/extensi...asyscreencast/

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        • #14
          Originally posted by birdie View Post
          Oh yeah? Ever heard of rich APIs, no code duplication which Wayland basically forces on developers which is why we have basically just two DEs which support it fully, eg Gnome and KDE while others like IceWM has rejected to support this craziness?
          Well GNOME supports it already. You can't blame the upsteam developers that they don't bend backwards to accommodate every random Joe's me-too hobby project compositor. Even if they wasted time supporting IceWM at the expense of more urgent matters, all three users of EvenMoreObscureWM would immediately start whining. Nobody forces you at gun point to use GNOME/Mutter, but at the same time, requiring the other developers to do the work needed to implement the required features themselves seems like a reasonable proposition. What's next, blaming GCC devs that the C++20 consteval support introduced in GCC 11 doesn't magically work out of the box in my very own toy compiler ?

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          • #15
            Originally posted by birdie View Post
            But it's lean and fast and tear-free!
            I don't use a Wayland compositor yet... (and I don't plan to, at least not until things really improve)
            Guess what? Even under Wayland I get stuttering.

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            • #16
              Originally posted by jacob View Post

              You don't need to write any code, it's already done. Here is but one among several:

              gnome
              That's the problem. It's compositor specific. Clearly crafted from the start to be by GNOME for GNOME.

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              • #17
                Originally posted by tildearrow View Post

                That's the problem. It's compositor specific. Clearly crafted from the start to be by GNOME for GNOME.
                OBS will work with Pipewire, which Plasma Wayland integrates with as the standard.

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                • #18
                  Originally posted by tildearrow View Post

                  That's the problem. It's compositor specific. Clearly crafted from the start to be by GNOME for GNOME.
                  Of course it is. Wayland is not software, it's a protocol specification document. If you want one particular implementation of Wayland to have some feature, it needs to implement it.

                  It wasn't really different under X11 actually, except that 1) for the past 15 years or so there has only been one true implementation of X11, Xorg, although back in the early days of Linux there were other ones as well (MetroX etc.) Since no-one regrets those times, I don't really see why some people insist on bringing in their own, fragment-happy implementations of Wayland compositors either. And 2) the fact that such tools ran under X11 as simple clients was due to X11's built-in security hole that allowed anyone to access and capture any window including the root window (i.e. the entire screen). Wayland fixes that particular design flaw, which is a Good Thing.

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                  • #19
                    Originally posted by tildearrow View Post
                    And so what? I have to write my recording/casting code 10 times now? One time for each compositor?
                    This is no in fact. You only need to support two methods.

                    Method 1) Most wayland compositors support xdg-desktop-portal for screen recording and capture that then can use pipewire and this can use accelerated encoding does not need major privilege assigned to application to work.
                    Method 2) Direct use libdrm
                    https://obsproject.com/forum/threads...-linux.101262/
                    Different parties have done method 2 this requires you application have something with cap_sys_admin privilege and this can screen capture anything on Linux.

                    Support Method 2 and you can screen capture all Wayland/X11/Terminal... outputs.

                    So not 10 different methods or One type per compositor. You only need 2 methods to screen capture everything. The reality is if you did not support direct libdrm screen capture anyhow you could not capture everything already.

                    Originally posted by tildearrow View Post
                    And where are the permission-based global key listening features? Like to trigger hotkeys?
                    https://github.com/snyball/Hawck

                    Good question does that really need to be part of wayland or should it be done like Hawck here. Hawck here grabs the keyboard/device you want to macro exclusively then makes a new fake input device for wayland/X11/console to use instead.

                    Yes Hawck is example of something like method 2 in the first section. Different way to skin cat.

                    Or should this be done as part of accessibility? There is kind of a nice on going arguement how this should be done.

                    Remember not every user need applications using global hotkeys. The users who don't use any applications that need global hotkeys having global hotkeys support is a security risk.

                    Global key listening feature is not a every user need feature maybe this should require installing and activating something like Hawck to have it.

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                    • #20
                      Originally posted by gfunk View Post
                      Surely there is thousands of bugs and features that need to be implemented for Wayland? like screen casting/recording
                      Screen recording/casting is implemented since the beginning. OBS and all the usual browsers support it for a long time by now. In fact, if you use Gnome, then you can enjoy DMA-Buf based screen recording with nearly zero CPU usage but only on wayland of course.

                      Also, Wayland is a protocol specification, compositors need to implement it.

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