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The 2020 State Of Wayland Support For Chrome/Chromium - Aiming For H2'2021 Default

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  • #11
    Originally posted by ms178 View Post
    The days of X11 seem numbered then? Not only is it unmaintained but Chromium losing its X11 backend is the last nail in the coffin. I hope all the nasty bugs still left with Wayland will be fixed up until then or we will see a regression in overall desktop usability and stability for the next few years.
    They've always been numbered.
    The only nuance is that the countdown started around 5000 days... We are probably around 3650 or so. Give it another 3-4 years.
    Last edited by Mez'; 27 October 2020, 09:43 AM.

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    • #12
      Originally posted by rabcor View Post

      Strange opinions always have to exist somewhere it seems.
      I don't know what is so strange about it. I guess that you've never tried Edge, but if you compare Chrome and Edge, side-by-side, then Edge is the nicer one.

      Originally posted by CommunityMember View Post

      The current dev channel version of Edge still uses X (which is to be expected), but, as you say, since it is based on Chromium, it should eventually make it to Wayland for those that choose Edge as their browser.

      While the progress has been slower than one would have wished for, the ozone capabilities (which will enable wayland for chromium and the related electron based apps) will be another step along the path of eliminating the need for at least some to have to run an xserver at all.
      Yeah, hopefully we will see Wayland in all Electron apps soon, and yeah that would eliminate the need for xserver and even XWayland for many people. Some Electron apps use very old versions of Electron though, now Electron is at version 10, but Atom still use version 6.

      Originally posted by Volta View Post

      It's shit, because it's from Microsoft. Don't you remember the times when we all had to struggle with M$ Internet Explorer web 'standards'? I see no single reason to support them now.
      Well, you might not like Microsoft but technically Edge is not shit. From a technical perspective it is a very good browser, and from a user experience perspective it is a very good browser.
      Also, the Microsoft of today is very different from the Microsoft of two decades ago.
      Before Microsoft's hated open source and their cash cows were Windows and Office, today Microsoft is a huge supporter of open source and their cash cows are Azure and Xbox.

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      • #13
        Originally posted by uid313 View Post

        Microsoft Edge is not shit, it is actually a very good web browser. It is built on Chromium and its technology such as Blink, so it has all the features and performance of Chrome. Microsoft improved upon Chromium so things are easier organized in the menus and it has some nice improvements. While I personally prefer Firefox, I do think of Microsoft Edge as a better version of Chrome.
        I agree. Anyone saying it's shit and using Chrome/ium has horse blinkers on.
        As much as I hate to admit it (I don't hate Microsoft but most of what they do doesn't work for me), you're right. I've been using Edge for a week as my backup browser (only for a couple of use cases) to Firefox (most).

        Before that, at home (Linux only) I tried:
        - Midori - but lately they've made it so slow and buggy with the CSD that it's worthless, such a shame because it was great 5 years ago
        - Chromium - no favorite button, little customization, no global setting to stop videos from autoplaying, favorite bar is forced on new tab (wasting vertical space), doesn't integrate in Unite extension
        - Chrome - almost no value added to Chromium and same issues
        - Falkon - loading pages is like a slideshow

        I still have no other choice but to use Windows and Chrome at work (included for internal webapps, so I'm not just browsing with it) and Chrome is my least favorite browser of all. Really crappy. I'm losing so much time dealing with its flaws. Loading speed (of pages) is like the stupidest indicator of getting things done in a browser. Well, as long as it's no slide show of course.
        Edge has added some value to Chromium and solved a few of the blocking issues of Chrome. For me, it's already the best alternative to Firefox. My only complaint is the automatic reloading of pages, so if I go check on a definition or fact in a new tab, I might lose the text or input I was writing on the initial tab. Really frustrating. But it's only in dev for now so hopefully it will be corrected or tweakable. Don't know if it's the same on Windows (my work Edge version is still pre-Chromium).

        Of course, Firefox is head and shoulders above the others. It has more features and through CSS or about:config you can tailor it to your workflow and use cases in a lot of ways. While I can't even put tabs back below the URL bar (feels more intuitive to me) on any other browser. Sure it loads pages a bit slower, and yet since it's more adapted to my workflow I'm still faster doing stuff.
        Last edited by Mez'; 27 October 2020, 09:46 AM.

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        • #14
          Originally posted by uid313 View Post
          Well, you might not like Microsoft but technically Edge is not shit. From a technical perspective it is a very good browser, and from a user experience perspective it is a very good browser.
          You are technically correct, the best kind of correct.

          While I'm no supporter of MS, I have to agree with the above. I had tried it and it is basically a re-skinned version of Chromium. So calling it shit is the same as calling Chromium shit, which it is certainly not.

          Unfortunately, at the time I had tried it, I found a crippling and unacceptable flaw on Linux: you cannot download Chrome using it, since at the Google website the download doesn't start. Firefox downloaded fine from Mozilla tough. This is a outrage because you cannot use it the same way it is used on Windows.
          Last edited by M@GOid; 27 October 2020, 09:41 AM.

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          • #15
            Originally posted by uid313 View Post
            Yeah, hopefully we will see Wayland in all Electron apps soon, and yeah that would eliminate the need for xserver and even XWayland for many people. Some Electron apps use very old versions of Electron though, now Electron is at version 10, but Atom still use version 6.
            I might have the version number wrong, but I think electron version 11 is supposed to be targeted to have ozone support with wayland, and Microsoft has at least tentatively agreed to move to version 11 when it is ready (and, of course, once it passes their internal QA) for their visual studio code editor and teams apps. I don't know what the plans are for discord, slack, atom, or the myriad of other electron apps that exist, but at some point one has to believe they will need/want to upgrade if only to get security and feature support, but in any case, once electron supports wayland users of those various apps can start bugging the developers to upgrade their electron (a number of public bug trackers have tickets where users have been asking for wayland support for years for some apps, and the response has typically been that electron does not support it; that excuse should go away soon).

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            • #16
              Originally posted by Volta View Post
              Yeah, I'm dying to use M$ shit on Linux.
              At this point the biggest bad actor in town is probably Google. Especially if Edge closes the spyware loophole that's built into Chromium that sends all of your personal data to Google.

              I'm in no hurry to install Edge, however if Microsoft has closed that then they have done us all a huge favor and Edge is absolutely worth using.

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              • #17
                Originally posted by Volta View Post
                Don't you remember the times ....
                I do remember the times. I remember when ATI/AMD only had a closed source driver and had no interest in working with those of us in the open source community. Times change.

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                • #18
                  Originally posted by Mez' View Post
                  While I can't even put tabs back below the URL bar
                  It seems that is feasible on Chrome for Android.
                  I do really dislike the disparity between platforms though (no extension on Android for instance).

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                  • #19
                    Originally posted by uid313 View Post
                    I do think of Microsoft Edge as a better version of Chrome.
                    Call me up when MS Edge is as customizable as Vivaldi and has a built-in mail client (I know, Vivaldi doesn't currently have that either, but there was an official announcement by the lead dev that it will be released in the next few weeks), which is also based on Chromium.

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                    • #20
                      Originally posted by Mez' View Post
                      - Falkon - loading pages is like a slideshow
                      That's probably an OS issue. I've been using Falkon on and off ever since it was still QupZilla (before KDE took over) and while it certainly has room for improvement, I never ever experienced any page loading issues - all pages are loaded very quickly, on par with basically any other browser.

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