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Canonical Developers Now Preparing Mir 1.0 For Release With Wayland Support

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    hoohoo
    Senior Member

  • hoohoo
    replied
    Originally posted by TheBlackCat View Post

    The first one. Kwin is divided into three parts: a native X11-specific part, a native Wayland-specific part, and a shared part that works with either. The X11-specific part does not require Wayland and the Wayland-specific part does not require X11. You can run a Wayland session inside the X11 kwin version, and you can run an X11 session inside the Wayland kwin version, but the Wayland version can run without any X11 at all, and the X11 version can run without Wayland at all. The shared part doesn't care, it can run with the Wayland or X11 version.
    Fanstastic! I will try it out. Thanks for explaining!

    Leave a comment:

  • TheBlackCat
    Senior Member

  • TheBlackCat
    replied
    Originally posted by hoohoo View Post
    Let me rephrase the question then: is KDE KWin a native implementation of Wayland protocol (ie compositor + server) and not a shim or wrapper that provides a Wayland protocol compliant interface atop an X server (which is, I do understand, an implementation of the X protocol)?
    The first one. Kwin is divided into three parts: a native X11-specific part, a native Wayland-specific part, and a shared part that works with either. The X11-specific part does not require Wayland and the Wayland-specific part does not require X11. You can run a Wayland session inside the X11 kwin version, and you can run an X11 session inside the Wayland kwin version, but the Wayland version can run without any X11 at all, and the X11 version can run without Wayland at all. The shared part doesn't care, it can run with the Wayland or X11 version.

    Leave a comment:

  • hoohoo
    Senior Member

  • hoohoo
    replied
    Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
    Wayland is a protocol, like X11. Its server component is much slimmer than Xorg (which is the server of X11 protocol).

    So what once were desktop compositors offloading to Xorg, become Wayland "servers" by integrating the server component into themselves.
    Let me rephrase the question then: is KDE KWin a native implementation of Wayland protocol (ie compositor + server) and not a shim or wrapper that provides a Wayland protocol compliant interface atop an X server (which is, I do understand, an implementation of the X protocol)?

    Thanks!

    Leave a comment:

  • starshipeleven
    Premium Supporter

  • starshipeleven
    replied
    Originally posted by hoohoo View Post
    Want to make sure I understand you: KDE's KWin "window manager" is built on Wayland and not X?
    Wayland is a protocol, like X11. Its server component is much slimmer than Xorg (which is the server of X11 protocol).

    So what once were desktop compositors offloading to Xorg, become Wayland "servers" by integrating the server component into themselves.

    Leave a comment:

  • profoundWHALE
    Senior Member

  • profoundWHALE
    replied
    Originally posted by hoohoo View Post

    Want to make sure I understand you: KDE's KWin "window manager" is built on Wayland and not X?
    Kwin was/is being ported to Wayland. I don't really understand how it could be built on Wayland if it existed before Wayland was doing things.

    Leave a comment:

  • hoohoo
    Senior Member

  • hoohoo
    replied
    Originally posted by shmerl View Post

    Wayland is a protocol. Actual servers / compositors use Wayland. KWin / Mutter are KDE / Gnome examples. Mir is another example (not sure what it's going to be used for). It's different from X, where X itself meant the protocol and the server.
    Want to make sure I understand you: KDE's KWin "window manager" is built on Wayland and not X?

    Leave a comment:

  • hoohoo
    Senior Member

  • hoohoo
    replied
    Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
    It's probably not your choice anyway, your distro maintainers will decide when to switch.
    In general, sure. OTOH I have several times built X from source. If Wayland offered a clean X-free implementation (with a supported browser & terminal program I suppose) I might build it myself too.

    Leave a comment:

  • Charlie68
    Senior Member

  • Charlie68
    replied
    Originally posted by vegabook View Post

    We should all be on our hands and knees thanking Mark Shuttleworth for Ubuntu. He's spent many tens of millions of dollars of his own money on this distro. He's estimated net worth is 150m USD. He sold his certificate business for 500m USD. He's plunged hundreds of millions into Ubuntu, and by extension, Linux.

    All this anti-canonical waffle from these geriatric, myopic, greybeards, who can't rub two brain cells together anymore, is so last century. Let's not forget that the only serious other contributions to Linux comes from massively profitable corporations. Canonical is _losing_ money supporting Linux and is therefore closer to the ethos of open source than any of these so-called purists want to admit.

    Personally I run server-side systemd all day long as rock-solid as Mount Rushmore, and couldn't give a flying foxtrot about stone-age init scripts. On desktop, shit just works with Ubuntu. All the blobs are pre-installed. No bull. No wonder it beats Fedora hands down, let alone all the other single-digit share guys. The only serious competitors to Ubuntu are derivatives of Ubuntu, or its parent, Debian, which can thank Ubuntu for the intro, as far as most end-user Debian people are concerned.
    I estimate all companies investing in free software, so even Canonical. Ubuntu is a good distribution, but there are better distributions of higher quality.

    Leave a comment:

  • Danielsan
    Senior Member

  • Danielsan
    replied
    Originally posted by vegabook View Post
    We should all be on our hands and knees thanking Mark Shuttleworth for Ubuntu. He's spent many tens of millions of dollars of his own money on marketing...
    This makes more sense...

    Leave a comment:

  • unixfan2001
    Senior Member

  • unixfan2001
    replied
    Originally posted by caligula View Post

    Wayland fixes the core problems with X. That is, at least they promise us absolutely tear free video, shorter round trips and latency, fixes for things like screen locker not activating if a right button menu is active, screen saver crash leading to exposed desktop, inefficient remote protocol for modern toolkits (remote X & GTK/Qt), disabling the possibility to perform key logging or screenshots whenever the attacker wants. Some X users also still suffer from X run as root, X tied to a tty, silly bash like launch scripts (startx, xinit etc). Oh and some eye candy like non-rectangle Windows. Many users have also disable a slew of deprecated features which were more relevant 30 years ago.
    Those can be done on X11, as well.

    Leave a comment:

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