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AMD's Vulkan Driver Will Only Work With The AMDGPU Kernel Driver

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  • devius
    replied
    Originally posted by bridgman View Post
    People sometimes forget that GCN is short for Graphics Core Next, not Graphics Chip Next
    Meh, I always read it as GameCube Nintendo anyway...

    Oops.... wrong forum

    Leave a comment:


  • Veerappan
    replied
    Originally posted by Sonadow View Post

    Right, this just proves once and for all that all that "release the source and the documentation and the community will do everything" demands made in the past is a flaming pile of bullshit
    "Everything" is a strong word, but the community does contribute. The fact that all of the gallium state trackers are shared among drivers for multiple cards/systems and that all mesa drivers share a GLSL compiler is a great thing, it reduces the amount of effort required to bring up new drivers, and eases *some* of the maintenance burden for everyone. It doesn't mean that you get a free driver, but you are allowing interested 3rd parties to get involved. The community doesn't just mean random volunteers; it means volunteers, hardware vendors, os vendors, other software vendors, and anyone else with a vested interest.

    By going with an open-source driver, you're also allowing people who think they've run into a bug in your driver a way to find out why things aren't working. Have you seen the turnaround time on how quickly fixes to mesa can get committed to the upstream repository for some new games? Not always, mind you, but there's times that the fix is committed upstream within hours of the user bug report coming in... and that allows the user to quickly test and confirm that their issue is actually fixed. I'd gladly take a fix in a day or so, instead of having to wait a month or two for a new driver to come out.

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  • bridgman
    replied
    .... aaaaand I've been moderated again. Bleah.

    Maybe this is why people are tweeting instead of using forums.

    EDIT - post above has now appeared.
    Last edited by bridgman; 16 January 2016, 03:12 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • bridgman
    replied
    Originally posted by haagch View Post
    Wait, AMD does think about supporting older GCN GPUs with amdgpu? The last time the question came up the reply was more like "why would you want that?"...
    Pretty simple really. For new things like Vulkan, we started development on the code base we know we'll be using going forward (amdgpu kernel driver and libdrm-amdgpu). The standard was evolving, as was our code, so it didn't make sense to lock in the kernel driver design for older hardware too early until everything settled down (which it has recently).

    If we were not in the middle of a kernel driver transition this would be a non-issue, but since both IOCTLs and internal structure of the kernel drivers changed between radeon and amdgpu the decision depends a lot on what functionality the userspace drivers ended up needing.

    There are three obvious options for pre-VI Vulkan support:

    1. run Vulkan over the radeon userspace library (libdrm-radeon/radeon winsys),

    2. run Vulkan over the amdgpu userspace library but extend it to support radeon IOCTLs as well as amdgpu IOCTLs, or

    3. extend amdgpu support back to earlier GCN parts and either find a way to replace radeon as the upstream default or eat the ongoing cost of working on two kernel drivers

    There is also the option using option #2 for SI and option #3 for CI, of course.

    With options #1 or #2 everything would run over the radeon kernel driver, so there really would have been little or no user benefit to running SI/CI hardware on amdgpu. With option #3 there would be a benefit to running SI/CI on amdgpu and so we would adjust our plans accordingly.

    Everyone is probably thinking "hey SI and CI are pretty much the same are you guys stupid or what ?" but outside of the shader core SI actually has more in common with NI than with CI. Since shader core interaction is primarily handled by the userspace drivers, you can see what this means from a kernel driver perspective.

    People sometimes forget that GCN is short for Graphics Core Next, not Graphics Chip Next
    Last edited by bridgman; 16 January 2016, 06:54 PM.

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  • Sonadow
    replied
    Originally posted by mannerov View Post

    The advantage of going open source is not to have little fairies do all the work.
    In fact if you read some analysis of people working in the field, you'll find that companies are pretty well aware of that.

    Most of the contributions has to come from the company. Then the little fairies will do some minor but interesting contributions, enhance compatibility, do fixes, find regressions, etc.
    That's exactly what happens with Mesa to me. People do report regressions, do implement some extensions, do some fixes, and some other things (gallium nine, etc).
    Originally posted by chithanh
    Yeah, well, community ≠ unpaid volunteers.
    Right, this just proves once and for all that all that "release the source and the documentation and the community will do everything" demands made in the past is a flaming pile of bullshit

    Leave a comment:


  • chithanh
    replied
    Yeah, well, community ≠ unpaid volunteers.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nille
    replied
    Originally posted by chithanh View Post
    For example, airlied did the tesselation work.
    The Red Hat employee that get payed to work on the FOSS-Drivers.

    Leave a comment:


  • chithanh
    replied
    Originally posted by Nille View Post
    The Community is a lie. If amd not stepped up for foss driver development, we would have today the status from 6-7 years ago.
    A couple of major Mesa radeonsi features were backported to r600g by the community. For example, airlied did the tesselation work.

    I don't see why it must be "a lie" when it comes to the kernel.

    Leave a comment:


  • mannerov
    replied
    Originally posted by Nille View Post

    The Community is a lie. If amd not stepped up for foss driver development, we would have today the status from 6-7 years ago.
    The advantage of going open source is not to have little fairies do all the work.
    In fact if you read some analysis of people working in the field, you'll find that companies are pretty well aware of that.

    Most of the contributions has to come from the company. Then the little fairies will do some minor but interesting contributions, enhance compatibility, do fixes, find regressions, etc.
    That's exactly what happens with Mesa to me. People do report regressions, do implement some extensions, do some fixes, and some other things (gallium nine, etc).

    Leave a comment:


  • Nille
    replied
    Originally posted by Michael View Post
    You Can Help Bring Vulkan Support To Older AMD GCN GPUs http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Help-Bring-Older-GCN-To-AMDGPU
    The Community is a lie. If amd not stepped up for foss driver development, we would have today the status from 6-7 years ago.

    Leave a comment:

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