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  • Originally posted by dragon321 View Post
    Windows doesn't support OpenGL and Vulkan. They work on Windows only because x86 Windows supports something called "Installable Client Driver" that allows drivers developers to provide their own implementations of those APIs. I said "x86" because this feature is not present on ARM Windows and Xbox - these platforms don't support OpenGL and Vulkan natively at all.
    This compatibility pack allows more of your favorite OpenCL™, OpenGL®, and Vulkan® apps to run on a Windows 10 or Windows 11 PC that doesn't have these hardware drivers installed by default. If a DirectX 12 driver is installed, supported apps will run with hardware acceleration for better performance. This package supports apps that use OpenCL version 3.0 and earlier, OpenGL version 3.3 and earlier, and Vulkan version 1.2 and earlier. OpenGL apps using versions up to 4.6 may work as well. For more info, visit https://aka.ms/clglcp-faq OpenCL and the OpenCL logo are trademarks of Apple Inc. used with permission by Khronos. Complete license details are available on the Apple website (https://developer.apple.com/softwarelicensing/opencl/). OpenGL® and the oval logo are trademarks or registered trademarks of Hewlett Packard Enterprise in the United States and/or other countries worldwide. Vulkan and the Vulkan logo are registered trademarks of the Khronos Group Inc. Product is based on a published Khronos Specification and is expected to pass the Khronos Conformance Process. Current conformance status can be found at www.khronos.org/conformance.


    Its really a not fun location. On arm Microsoft has finally done what they wanted on Vista. Where Opengl, OpenCl and vulkan are implemented on top of the Direct X layer.

    Yes having to use Microsoft store so you have Opengl, Opencl and Vulkan support is not what you call fun.

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    • Originally posted by Artim View Post
      Rumors are not prove for anything. Apple did a lot more than just spreading rumors. But where the fuck did MS actually and fundamentally undermine OpenGL? By that time the only graphics API they undermined with their sheer incompetence was DirectX/Direct3D.
      you really do not know what Microsoft did. it was the time before OpenGL1.0 was released the time when Microsoft was member of khronos. they used their membership to apply delay tactics to OpenGL and not only delay tactics it was also a complicating tactics​ they pushed Khronos to make OpenGL as high level as possible well known this will tank performance and microsoft with directX did go the other route and did make it more low-level to outperform OpenGL in every benchmark. this was the reason why OpenGL was delayed and later outperformed by directX...

      Well, it’s not about which one is better. It’s about the development history of both of them, the 2 giants in the graphics accelerator API which has made this world full of beautiful ga…


      most people lost memory about the khronos membership time of microsoft... microsoft did leave the khronos before openGL 1.0 was even released. after openGL1.0 was released it did take microsoft 14 years to rejoin khronos group to be part of the WebGL section for webbrowsers.
      Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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      • Originally posted by blackiwid View Post
        They just killed XBox as hardware, will have to give up meaningfull Xbox S support because the fucking garbage hardware can't even produce >720p stable, they moved all their games to this xbox pass, do they care if people would by xbox pass for Linux? No a sell is a sell...
        Maintaining a own tool set just for the only reason to be incompatible is also a cost, meanwhile most games run nice under Linux anyway, They math just don't plays out anymore.
        5 years ago they weren't that big of a games company, if they make windows games incompatible to Linux their own games written with that technology might sell less because of missing steam deck compatibility, also they barely can keep up with Linux development, if you install 5 times windows 11 you get with AMD hardware 15 different FPS numbers apparently based on a random generator or something alike...
        I mean the same reason they just mostly go away from exclusive Xbox games, and port all their games so PS5 there they even pay devs to make it compatible with the competitor, here they just stop paying money to prevent 3rd party to make the games intentionally incompatible to Linux, this makes sense why should they threat Linux so vastly opposite than PS5?
        Could there be same plan to Extinguish Linux, sure but if so, it will fail because Linux has proven again and again that it is immune to this attempts, and for all the people that believe that MS plays 3d chess and always succeeds with their plans, they didn't plan to have Xbox completely die, yet it happened that is a zombie console and Sony has won the Console wars (and so far Nintendo on the Handheld Console front).
        you are absolutly right. the microsoft stradgy to keep xbox alive just to force game engine developers also to support directx is more or less death Proton/DXVK killed it. their time as console company is over playstation won the console war and with windows alone they can not keep directx alive without switching to SPIR-V...

        and microsoft it looks like as if they do no longer care xbox was always a lose in money and they did always only make money on the games sales but they call sell the same games on playstation or even steam deck.

        microsoft really do many error the minecraft java clind in linux is a pain the game controlers do not work

        i do not unterstand why they do not sell the dirextX12 version of minecraft in valve steam store this would generate more money for them and then people would no longer be forced into this shit java version of the game.
        Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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        • Originally posted by qarium View Post

          you are absolutly right. the microsoft stradgy to keep xbox alive just to force game engine developers also to support directx is more or less death Proton/DXVK killed it. their time as console company is over playstation won the console war and with windows alone they can not keep directx alive without switching to SPIR-V...

          and microsoft it looks like as if they do no longer care xbox was always a lose in money and they did always only make money on the games sales but they call sell the same games on playstation or even steam deck.

          microsoft really do many error the minecraft java clind in linux is a pain the game controlers do not work

          i do not unterstand why they do not sell the dirextX12 version of minecraft in valve steam store this would generate more money for them and then people would no longer be forced into this shit java version of the game.
          In no way can you think Bedrock is better than Java edition. You high or something? Bedrock is just the official ripoff. And Bedrock edition doesn't run under Wine/Proton. They'd have to make it native and it'd still use OpenGL. And no amount of convincing to Steam users would make Minecraft sell, because it's the same shitty game, just on the Steam store.

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          • Originally posted by MillionToOne View Post
            In no way can you think Bedrock is better than Java edition. You high or something? Bedrock is just the official ripoff. And Bedrock edition doesn't run under Wine/Proton. They'd have to make it native and it'd still use OpenGL. And no amount of convincing to Steam users would make Minecraft sell, because it's the same shitty game, just on the Steam store.
            its pretty sure you talk bullshit... just see here:

            Bedrock Edition bezeichnet im Minecraft Wiki die offiziell „Minecraft“ genannten Versionen des Spiels, mit der das plattformübergreifende Spiel zwischen mobilen Geräten, Konsolen und PCs möglich ist[13]. Die Bedrock Edition für mobile Geräte heißt auch Pocket Edition. Die Abkürzung heißt „MCPE“. Technisch gesehen hat sie ihren Ursprung in der Pocket Edition auf mobilen Geräten und bzw. dessen Ableger für Windows 10 (Windows 10 Edition), Gear VR (Gear VR Edition) und Fire TV (Fire TV Edition) und


            "Ray tracing graphics (RTX) possible with appropriate hardware[20]."

            Lass deine Welten aufleuchten – mit Raytracing Beta für Windows 10 von Minecraft. Mit der Beta-Version kannst du deine Welten mit realistischem Licht und mehr ausstatten.


            Ray-Tracing does not exist in openGL... ray-tracing only works in DirectX12 and Vulkan

            the java edition does not support ray-tracing and also does not support game-controlers.
            Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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            • Originally posted by qarium View Post
              Ray-Tracing does not exist in openGL... ray-tracing only works in DirectX12 and Vulkan

              the java edition does not support ray-tracing and also does not support game-controlers.
              Here is a quick tutorial on how to use a controller (PlayStation, Xbox, Nintendo Switch, etc.) as input while playing the Java Edition of Minecraft. The Java Edition of Minecraft does not natively support controllers, but here there will be described easy workarounds that allows you to use a controller for playing Minecraft: Java Edition. In order to play Minecraft Java with a controller, you need an app that can run in the background and transmit the controller’s input to the game, and you need


              The Java edition not having controller support not noticing because game being installed by steam and the steam work around being used.

              There are also mods that bring controllers to java edition as well.

              Yes people get close to the look of hardware ray tracing with old tricks to emulate ray tracing using optifine with Minecraft.

              Vulkan renderer mod for Minecraft. Contribute to xCollateral/VulkanMod development by creating an account on GitHub.

              Yes people have modded in Vulkan support into java edition.

              What you wrote about bedrock vs java edition minecraft if you are talking stock is correct. Modded Java edition vs Modded Bedrock minecraft the feature list is way closer.

              qarium its really not a good thing to start a war over bedrock vs java edition java. Lot of the java edition people using mods to add most of the bedrock features and extras and forgot they have installed them. Yes to them their modded Java edition minecraft is massively superior to non modded bedrock minecraft.

              Yes modding community has habit of allowing very old games to have insanely modern features. Like you can play the original doom1 and doom2 with ray tracing if you want due to the modding.

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              • Originally posted by qarium View Post

                its pretty sure you talk bullshit... just see here:

                Bedrock Edition bezeichnet im Minecraft Wiki die offiziell „Minecraft“ genannten Versionen des Spiels, mit der das plattformübergreifende Spiel zwischen mobilen Geräten, Konsolen und PCs möglich ist[13]. Die Bedrock Edition für mobile Geräte heißt auch Pocket Edition. Die Abkürzung heißt „MCPE“. Technisch gesehen hat sie ihren Ursprung in der Pocket Edition auf mobilen Geräten und bzw. dessen Ableger für Windows 10 (Windows 10 Edition), Gear VR (Gear VR Edition) und Fire TV (Fire TV Edition) und


                "Ray tracing graphics (RTX) possible with appropriate hardware[20]."

                Lass deine Welten aufleuchten – mit Raytracing Beta für Windows 10 von Minecraft. Mit der Beta-Version kannst du deine Welten mit realistischem Licht und mehr ausstatten.


                Ray-Tracing does not exist in openGL... ray-tracing only works in DirectX12 and Vulkan

                the java edition does not support ray-tracing and also does not support game-controlers.
                Like I give a shit about RT in a block sandbox game. Come back to me when the trees in your garden start being cubes. And by openGL, I mean the Android version, which uses openGL and the Switch version. Why would they implement Vulkan when they have their DX12 implemented. Windows and Xbox are the only platforms using DX12, others use openGL or some implementation of it, like Sony.

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                • Originally posted by MillionToOne View Post
                  Like I give a shit about RT in a block sandbox game. Come back to me when the trees in your garden start being cubes. And by openGL, I mean the Android version, which uses openGL and the Switch version. Why would they implement Vulkan when they have their DX12 implemented. Windows and Xbox are the only platforms using DX12, others use openGL or some implementation of it, like Sony.
                  Playsation is purely it own beast not vulkan and not directx wither.

                  MillionToOne also not upto date on modded Minecraft.

                  Yes the instructions to use vulkanmod on android devices to use the vulkan output. Sometimes the opengl rendering on Android devices can be badly broken.

                  Vulkanmod does not work on switch because it only has Vulkan 1.0.

                  Yes Vulkanmod loaded into Java Minecraft you do have ray-tracing. So you might not care for it but for those modding the game they have that feature..


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                  • Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
                    Here is a quick tutorial on how to use a controller (PlayStation, Xbox, Nintendo Switch, etc.) as input while playing the Java Edition of Minecraft. The Java Edition of Minecraft does not natively support controllers, but here there will be described easy workarounds that allows you to use a controller for playing Minecraft: Java Edition. In order to play Minecraft Java with a controller, you need an app that can run in the background and transmit the controller’s input to the game, and you need

                    The Java edition not having controller support not noticing because game being installed by steam and the steam work around being used.
                    There are also mods that bring controllers to java edition as well.
                    this is all just theory and not practical even with hours of efford the person i tried to support was not able to use the controller and the mods more or less do not work. also not practival because every new minecraft version need a new version of this mod as well.. so in the end you forever run after the mainline and its a never ending problem and also does not work.
                    we tried multiple mods and it plain and simple does not work and also is not a solution at all.

                    Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
                    Yes people get close to the look of hardware ray tracing with old tricks to emulate ray tracing using optifine with Minecraft.
                    Vulkan renderer mod for Minecraft. Contribute to xCollateral/VulkanMod development by creating an account on GitHub.

                    Yes people have modded in Vulkan support into java edition.
                    we where not able to install the controller mod to use a game-contoller as input its really pointless
                    little children who play minecraft do not know how to install a mod. even the mother has no fucking clue in how to do it. and all websites online only talk about how to install mods on windows.
                    these people are overwhelmed​ and not able to do anything.
                    a vulkan mod is nonsense if this feature is not in the official version also a game controler mode is nonsense to if it is not in the official game.

                    yes hard to smallow fact for you as a full blown expert oiaohm... but reality outside of an expert's filter bubble is different.

                    Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
                    What you wrote about bedrock vs java edition minecraft if you are talking stock is correct. Modded Java edition vs Modded Bedrock minecraft the feature list is way closer.
                    you know why this is nonsense ? because you can not even join gamer servers with modded minecraft.

                    but you can join the game server with the official bedrock minecraft edition.
                    this means you can play with game controller and also raytracing with the bedrock edition and you can not do the same with a hacked or modded java edition.

                    Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
                    qarium its really not a good thing to start a war over bedrock vs java edition java. Lot of the java edition people using mods to add most of the bedrock features and extras and forgot they have installed them. Yes to them their modded Java edition minecraft is massively superior to non modded bedrock minecraft.
                    how exactly are these people happy if they can not even join a official server with that modded edition ?

                    Originally posted by oiaohm View Post
                    Yes modding community has habit of allowing very old games to have insanely modern features. Like you can play the original doom1 and doom2 with ray tracing if you want due to the modding.
                    i am not against modding all i say is that children or mothers of children who try to use linux instead of windows are heavily disappointed because the official windows version gives them what they want and if they try to play on linux they end up with mods do not work and they can not join server and they end up without raytracing and without gaming controller support and then you pop up and tell them they are stupid they can use all the mods and hacks in the world.
                    Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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                    • Originally posted by MillionToOne View Post
                      Like I give a shit about RT in a block sandbox game. Come back to me when the trees in your garden start being cubes. And by openGL, I mean the Android version, which uses openGL and the Switch version. Why would they implement Vulkan when they have their DX12 implemented. Windows and Xbox are the only platforms using DX12, others use openGL or some implementation of it, like Sony.
                      man your incompetence shines to the sky...

                      even if i agree you that RT does not matter other points do matter for example the missing gaming controller support in the java edititions and mods not working and you can not join official servers with modded minecraft version

                      also the performance penalty between OpenGL and DX12 is big very big just as big the performance penalty is between OpenGL and Vulkan

                      you end up need more performant hardware just because a game use openGL instead of Vulkan.

                      "Why would they implement Vulkan when they have their DX12 implemented."

                      i would even agree here if microsoft would allow to use the official windows Bedrock Edition with proton on linux but this is not the case.

                      proton supports DX12 just fine but you can not download and use the official windows Bedrock Edition​ on linux.

                      MillionToOne your secret message is clear you do not want that people use linux at all it just means people should be forced to use windows.
                      Phantom circuit Sequence Reducer Dyslexia

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