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A NVIDIA Engineer In His Spare Time Wrote A Vulkan Driver That Works On Older Raspberry Pi

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  • #41
    Originally posted by Giovanni Fabbro View Post
    You can get a mid-range phone from any company and every video program gets accelerated and can play 1080p (or higher) video on any capable screen,
    Mostly yes, this was fixed with Android 6 I think where whatever vendor-specific crap was unified under the OS abstraction layer. Before it was a crapshoot, and only the default player (preinstalled) was 100% sure to be able to play media with hardware acceleration.

    That's not "GPU" though, it's media decoding, another thing, done by what in embedded world is called "VPU" (video processing unit). On PC world where the GPU is huge, the video decoder/encoder is bundled in the GPU card but is still technically a separate thing.
    as well as 3D graphics support for any game on Google Play.
    3D support is buggy shit in many many devices, especially on Vulkan. I know some devs. You have to be very conservative in your 3D application or make a bunch of hardware-specific workarounds because of this.
    Just look at the reviews 3D games, in most cases there are lots of people complaining it crashes or freezes or whatever.

    Linux gets full GPU acceleration at your desktop/login manager...only on x86 hardware (prove me wrong).
    Completely tangential to my point.

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    • #42
      Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
      Mostly yes, this was fixed with Android 6 I think where whatever vendor-specific crap was unified under the OS abstraction layer. Before it was a crapshoot, and only the default player (preinstalled) was 100% sure to be able to play media with hardware acceleration.

      That's not "GPU" though, it's media decoding, another thing, done by what in embedded world is called "VPU" (video processing unit). On PC world where the GPU is huge, the video decoder/encoder is bundled in the GPU card but is still technically a separate thing.
      3D support is buggy shit in many many devices, especially on Vulkan. I know some devs. You have to be very conservative in your 3D application or make a bunch of hardware-specific workarounds because of this.
      Just look at the reviews 3D games, in most cases there are lots of people complaining it crashes or freezes or whatever.

      Completely tangential to my point.
      Vulkan isn't built for mobile GPU's in mind. That's why there's OpenGL ES.

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      • #43
        Originally posted by Giovanni Fabbro View Post
        Vulkan isn't built for mobile GPU's in mind.
        You just pulled that from your ass.

        A low-abstraction and low-CPU-overhead graphic API is great in low-performance devices where you should optimize to squeeze out performance out of the hardware. If the driver isn't garbage.

        That said, I didn't say OpenGL ES isn't buggy. I said Vulkan drivers are worse.

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        • #44
          Originally posted by krOoze View Post
          Does it have a shader compiler or does it still accept only assembly?
          Vulkan never included a shader compiler. AFAIK, you submit your shaders in SPIR-V.

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          • #45
            Originally posted by Giovanni Fabbro View Post
            Vulkan isn't built for mobile GPU's in mind. That's why there's OpenGL ES.
            Not true. Vulkan was designed to be able to scale from mobile to consoles, desktop, and cloud. It superseded OpenGL ES by about a decade.

            When you think to make such a statement, is there no little voice in the back of your head that says "hey, let's just double-check that"?

            From the official Vulkan home page (https://www.khronos.org/vulkan/ ):
            Vulkan is a new generation graphics and compute API that provides high-efficiency, cross-platform access to modern GPUs used in a wide variety of devices from PCs and consoles to mobile phones and embedded platforms.

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            • #46
              Originally posted by coder View Post
              Vulkan never included a shader compiler. AFAIK, you submit your shaders in SPIR-V.
              Of course it does. Only the shader happens to be in SPIR-V. Otherwisely the driver normally has an (optimizing) shader compiler.

              But IIRC these RPI drivers accepted only Broadcom Assembly, which is what I am asking. Can it already accept SPIR-V like normal Vulkan, or does it take only Broadcom assembly?

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              • #47
                Originally posted by starshipeleven View Post
                You just pulled that from your ass.

                A low-abstraction and low-CPU-overhead graphic API is great in low-performance devices where you should optimize to squeeze out performance out of the hardware. If the driver isn't garbage.
                Face the facts: Vulkan is built from Mantle, and AMD doesn't make mobile chips.

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                • #48
                  Originally posted by krOoze View Post
                  Of course it does. Only the shader happens to be in SPIR-V. Otherwisely the driver normally has an (optimizing) shader compiler.
                  People don't write shaders in SPIR-V. As normally understood, in graphics APIs, a shader compiler is the thing which takes GLSL or HLSL. I was trying to answer the question on the level that it was asked. The relevance of your answer often depends on how you ask the question.

                  Originally posted by krOoze View Post
                  IIRC these RPI drivers accepted only Broadcom Assembly, which is what I am asking. Can it already accept SPIR-V like normal Vulkan, or does it take only Broadcom assembly?
                  See, that wasn't so hard, was it? Unfortunately, I can't help you with that question.
                  Last edited by coder; 23 June 2020, 10:38 PM.

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                  • #49
                    Originally posted by Giovanni Fabbro View Post
                    Face the facts: Vulkan is built from Mantle, and AMD doesn't make mobile chips.
                    No, I don't think any part of Mantle survived, intact. I think Vulkan is built on the conceptual foundations of Mantle, as is DX12.

                    The biggest contribution Mantle made towards Vulkan was probably the inspiration and a proof-of-concept. AMD built Mantle as a prototype, simply to show what was possible with a lower-level API that had a more flexible threading model than either DX11 or OpenGL.

                    By no coincidence, it turns out that a low-overhead graphics API designed to work well on multi-core processors and modern GPUs also works quite well on modern mobile SoCs. And to the extent that Mantle wasn't up to that task, it's not hard to see Khronos' motivation to ensure that Vulkan is.

                    You're fighting a losing battle, bud. This board doesn't need more trolling. If you're called out for making an unsupported claim, your best bet is just to drop the matter and move on. Please don't waste our time by trying to double-down on weak counter-arguments.

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                    • #50
                      Sure, be condescending because you do not understand a question. It is called Shader module in Vulkan. And SPIR-V is no assembly (literally has intermediate representation in the name). Jeez.

                      Anyway, the author seemed to spend two months porting the shaders of the vkQuake3. That is also impressive, but bit of a shame. So I guess the answer is no...

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