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  • phoronix
    started a topic Google Gets Into The 3D Driver Game

    Google Gets Into The 3D Driver Game

    Phoronix: Google Gets Into The 3D Driver Game

    To help out the adoption of WebGL, the Khronos-backed API originally started by Mozilla that seeks to let web developers tap into modern graphics processors via the web-browser natively, has caused Google to get into the graphics driver game. WebGL binds to OpenGL ES 2.0, and with the Microsoft graphics drivers being more DirectX-optimized rather than OpenGL, Google's playing to Microsoft. Google wants more users to be able to use WebGL, particularly when running the Chrome browser, so they have just announced the Almost Native Graphics Layer Engine. The objective of ANGLE is to just take the subset of the OpenGL ES API exposed by WebGL and to translate those extensions into their DirectX 9.0c equivalents...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=ODA4MQ

  • Remco
    replied
    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    WebGL isn't hindering you from viewing a website that you must in order to do something.
    You can choose what websites you like and sites like Phoronix, the New York Times and Slashdot won't ever integrate 3D, ever.
    Don't be too sure about that. 3D logos, 3D transitions... designers would love to have 3D in their toolbox. But you can always block <canvas>, just like Flash or any other element.

    Leave a comment:


  • V!NCENT
    replied
    Originally posted by dfx. View Post
    or no, dear sir, i'm not going to continue this discussion or to provide anymore "proof" unless you will start to backing up any of your words with some.
    Fine. What do you want me to back up? It must be a claim. But then if I do I also expect you to do the same.

    interesting that you suggest to ditch Google with its own browser and extension while its advertisement policy it pretty fair deal.
    Na-na-na-na-no wait... You said Google makes money with ads. I showed you that they host an extention for their own browser that blocks these. I wasn't convincing you to holy join the 'Google movement' by using their browser. That's a difference.

    unlike seamless integration with almost every site i visit where NoScript is the only savior.
    WebGL isn't hindering you from viewing a website that you must in order to do something.
    You can choose what websites you like and sites like Phoronix, the New York Times and Slashdot won't ever integrate 3D, ever.
    I realy don't see the problem. By your reasoning your Intel IGP is powerful enough too, right? So what is holding you back?

    Leave a comment:


  • dfx.
    replied
    or no, dear sir, i'm not going to continue this discussion or to provide anymore "proof" unless you will start to backing up any of your words with some.

    PS:
    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    And what does that have to do with anything?
    this have to do with literally "putting your money where your mouth is". interesting that you suggest to ditch Google with its own browser and extension while its advertisement policy it pretty fair deal. unlike seamless integration with almost every site i visit where NoScript is the only savior.

    Leave a comment:


  • V!NCENT
    replied
    Originally posted by dfx. View Post
    interesting. i always though that Opengl is, in fact, cross-platform.
    it even says so in that link above - http://blog.wolfire.com/2010/01/Why-...nd-not-DirectX
    It is? Just like half of the WWW that you can't access in IE6... What are you trying to say here? Even C++ apps require an extra header in order for it to work under Windows... I thought that was cross platform too?

    you know, i decided to follow your "advice" and did exactly that - and you know what ? it works perfectly, as you can see.
    Wierd... Compositing is DirectX and Google Earth can be configured OpenGL... I tried it on Windows 7 Ultimate final, a nVidia QuadroFX mobile GPU and driver and it disabled Compositing... Could you make a video where you set it to OpenGL and put it on YouTube (or someplace else) because that screenshot is no proof.

    i probably forgot to mention but remember that "windows 7 laptop" i mentioned ? well, it has Ubuntu 9.10 also installed on it and guess what Ubuntu think about that ?
    It finds it gay? In all fairness, the Intel driver does have to identify itself as OpenGL 2.x compliant to be allowed to run most OpenGL apps. It makes the CPU spike. You know why? Because half of the heavy lifting is done by the CPU and you know why? Because it's not a fully compliant OpenGL 2.x and thus can't accelerate it fully.

    wow, looks like those damn mesa developers are liars too ! we better to write a bug-report so they could stop this FUD at once!
    These 'damn mesa' driver are developed by Intel. There's no open spec, or at least not last time I checked (that was quite a long time ago).

    oh... wait, looks like wikipedia is in cahoots with them ! aaaaaAAAA !
    "Like the X3500, X4500 supports DirectX 10 and Shader Model 4.0 features. Intel designed the GMA X4500 to be 200% faster than the GMA 3100 (G33 chipset) in 3DMark06 performance[21] and 70% faster than the GMA X3500 (G35 chipset).[22]"
    But not fully. Most is done by the CPU where possible and where not possible it doesn't run.

    and, probably, less then DirectX then...
    Which leads us back to the why of you saying that Google supports proprietary crap while it doesn't... Care to answer that?

    and i recall that Bill Gates is a famous philanthropist and did spend millions or even billions "in a sake of starving children".
    all hail our Microsoft overlords !
    Yeah, except for the fact that the Bill Gates foundation != Microsoft. I could dive into the fact of why that is a little unethical and a little evil too, but if you want to further discuss this than it would be better to PM me or else we would get offtopic.


    are they showing there how all of their servers erase "personal data" ? together with complete registry of all of their data servers and their serial numbers while swearing on their grandgrandmothers graves that they will never transfer that data anywhere or filter some juicy parts of it ?
    I can see what you did there. Fact is: no proof, no guilt. It's that simple. Making claims and suggestions is nothing more than making claims and suggestions.

    interesting, i though most of Google services are free and usually don't need any money to use them and, on the contrary, Google is getting paid for me watching advertisements and stuff.
    And what does that have to do with anything? You might want to check this Google hosted Chrome extention:
    https://chrome.google.com/extensions...namgkkbiglidom
    The pleasure is all mine...

    as for you, i advise, next time you will talking shit about OpenGL from your little stinky mouth - get some facts, references and actual technical details to back up FUD which you call yours "point of view".
    Sais the person who was spreading FUD about Google's privacy compliance in the first place.

    what about abomination in subject - existence of crap like that is a perfect excuse for Microsoft to actually break OpenGL in a future and leave poor bastards on firefox in their "Linux"-machines with thousands of ugly broken sites.
    Yeah, what about it?

    i, however, hope that shit like putting 3D graphics into stupid web-pages and not vice versa (let funky pages be in full-scale 3D environment) will never spread and flourish in the world in any case.
    Like with all websites; if it sucks then it won't get popular and you can avoid them if you'd like. Google understood this by making a searchengine that had a text based website with only one tiny image.

    Leave a comment:


  • dfx.
    replied
    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    Because Microsoft wants to get a monopoly on everything, which is why Google's enabling the cross platform on Windows, so people don't have to opt for Windows-only code.
    interesting. i always though that Opengl is, in fact, cross-platform.
    it even says so in that link above - http://blog.wolfire.com/2010/01/Why-...nd-not-DirectX

    Microsoft does not have "a monopoly" on html nor opengl. it uses same FUD crap to intimidate people if not to use their proprietary "extensions" directly but, at least, to use and check against their crappy implementation of something open.
    same thing here - make devs use some crutchy way instead of a direct one even though direct way works perfectly normal or even if it is not - not to give a reason to "fix" it...

    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    Get your ass behind a Windows Vista/7 computer, download Google Earth, set it to OpenGL and you compositing is gone.
    you know, i decided to follow your "advice" and did exactly that - and you know what ? it works perfectly, as you can see.

    and now take your stupid ass and beat the shit out of it so it could stop to affect your brain.

    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    Liar. Liar. Big fat liar. The GMA4500M isn't a complete implemenation of OpenGL. Maybe it 'works great' when you want to render OpenGL triangles. Wow.
    i probably forgot to mention but remember that "windows 7 laptop" i mentioned ? well, it has Ubuntu 9.10 also installed on it and guess what Ubuntu think about that ?

    Code:
    OpenGL vendor string: Tungsten Graphics, Inc
    OpenGL renderer string: Mesa DRI Mobile Intel? GM45 Express Chipset GEM 20090712 2009Q2 RC3 
    OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 7.6
    OpenGL shading language version string: 1.20
    wow, looks like those damn mesa developers are liars too ! we better to write a bug-report so they could stop this FUD at once!

    oh... wait, looks like wikipedia is in cahoots with them ! aaaaaAAAA !

    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    >.< WebGL != OpenGL. It's more like OpenGL ES and Glide. Way to completely miss the point...
    and, probably, less then DirectX then...

    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    Oh I'm sorry, did you just quoted Wikipedia? Funny, I recall they needed extra funds for OGG video streaming and Google donated 1 million buck for it lately.
    and i recall that Bill Gates is a famous philanthropist and did spend millions or even billions "in a sake of starving children".
    all hail our Microsoft overlords !

    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    And you are a personal witness of the Googleplex meeting? You are making claims, namely that Google "turns" evil.
    are they showing there how all of their servers erase "personal data" ? together with complete registry of all of their data servers and their serial numbers while swearing on their grandgrandmothers graves that they will never transfer that data anywhere or filter some juicy parts of it ?

    if yes then i should see that.

    Originally posted by V!NCENT View Post
    In the name of common sense I say to you that if you do not like using something, based on your assumptions that it is "turning" evil, then you might want to actually put your money where your mouth is.
    interesting, i though most of Google services are free and usually don't need any money to use them and, on the contrary, Google is getting paid for me watching advertisements and stuff.

    in a name of common sense, i do what is profitable or otherwise useful to do according to my beliefs and a "price" to pay for those doings.
    as for you, i advise, next time you will talking shit about OpenGL from your little stinky mouth - get some facts, references and actual technical details to back up FUD which you call yours "point of view".

    what about abomination in subject - existence of crap like that is a perfect excuse for Microsoft to actually break OpenGL in a future and leave poor bastards on firefox in their "Linux"-machines with thousands of ugly broken sites.

    i, however, hope that shit like putting 3D graphics into stupid web-pages and not vice versa (let funky pages be in full-scale 3D environment) will never spread and flourish in the world in any case.

    Leave a comment:


  • V!NCENT
    replied
    Originally posted by t.s. View Post
    .. Except that when Ones have much-much power, they become.. you know what
    May the force be with you
    That's no moon!
    and...
    It's a trap!

    *God, I've been reading too much /. *

    Leave a comment:


  • t.s.
    replied
    Originally posted by BlueKoala View Post
    Google is the people's champion these days. Kinda how MS was in the 80's.

    I really don't see anything negative in all this.
    .. Except that when Ones have much-much power, they become.. you know what
    May the force be with you

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueKoala
    replied
    Google is the people's champion these days. Kinda how MS was in the 80's.

    I really don't see anything negative in all this.

    Leave a comment:


  • V!NCENT
    replied
    Originally posted by dfx. View Post
    and HTML is an open standard. dare to explain how such abominations as IE6 or IE-only sites, business web apps and hardware management GUIs got "invented" ?
    Because Microsoft wants to get a monopoly on everything, which is why Google's enabling the cross platform on Windows, so people don't have to opt for Windows-only code.

    interesting... i heard that it "wants" to do so, i believe it wants to do so but i'm also heared about Nvidia and Ati releasing OpenGL 3.x-capable drivers for Windows(r).
    is that a lie then and they do not work?
    Get your ass behind a Windows Vista/7 computer, download Google Earth, set it to OpenGL and you compositing is gone. Fine, there is OpenGL 'support', okey good, however Microsoft does anything in its power to make sure OpenGL implementations can only be limited in access to the entire OS and thus making sure OpenGL drivers won't work so good for real-time endusers. And guess what? OpenGL on Windows sucks when using the nVidia driver and when installing that same driver for Linux makes OpenGL fps skyrocket. Guess what? You haven't been following the tech news. Great.

    strange, i have here a brand-new laptop from my friend and it has Intel GMA4500M card and Windows 7(tm) on it. works just fine with OpenGL 2.1
    Liar. Liar. Big fat liar. The GMA4500M isn't a complete implemenation of OpenGL. Maybe it 'works great' when you want to render OpenGL triangles. Wow.

    "made viable" by providing a way to skip its use altogether... right...
    >.< WebGL != OpenGL. It's more like OpenGL ES and Glide. Way to completely miss the point...

    Oh I'm sorry, did you just quoted Wikipedia? Funny, I recall they needed extra funds for OGG video streaming and Google donated 1 million buck for it lately.

    and you are personal witness of that, i presume ?
    And you are a personal witness of the Googleplex meeting? You are making claims, namely that Google "turns" evil.

    and who are you anyway to say what i, or anyone else for that matter, must do ?
    In the name of common sense I say to you that if you do not like using something, based on your assumptions that it is "turning" evil, then you might want to actually put your money where your mouth is.

    Leave a comment:

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