NVIDIA Alerts Nouveau: They're Starting To Sign/Validate GPU Firmware Images

[Luke]

I would not consider Apple under any circumstances

Seems like we agree on plenty of things. To bad AMD never got popular in the thin notebook market. I don't even know what AMD-based product is in the same league as the retina Macbook Pro (good battery life, decent performance, hi-res screen, price seems less than identical Windows 8 competitors).

Printing a CPU at home; that sounds AWESOME!

Also, I'm glad NVIDIA gave Nouveau the heads up on this one. Though, it's unfortunate that when one part of hardware opens up (the booting process thanks to Coreboot) another closes.

I can't stand Apple's association with Foxconn (home of worker suicides at their mainland China plant), their dedication to closed ecosystems, or their pricing. As such, it does not matter to me if an Apple product is technically superior to what I am considering, as the Apple product essentially does not exist to me. My only laptops have been tiny netbooks chosen for low price and light weight, and at the time AMD did not have anything in that market. Now they do, at a moderate price penalty but better performance. The only Intel desktops I have worked with have been random source used ones given to me/belonging to friends/from the dumpster. Any new desktop stuff has always been AMD.

[liam]

IPlenty of people say Israel turned the Gaza Strip into the current largest concentration camp in the world.

Plenty of folks say the holocaust didn't happen (or wasn't as bad as the many, many, many first-hand accounts have said).
To call Gaza a "concentration camp" is to render that phrase meaningless.
Just to curtail any further digressions, I believe that a two-state solution is the only ethical solution. That, and probably reparations for the Palastinian's displacement.

[DMJC]

I can't stand Apple's association with Foxconn (home of worker suicides at their mainland China plant), their dedication to closed ecosystems, or their pricing. As such, it does not matter to me if an Apple product is technically superior to what I am considering, as the Apple product essentially does not exist to me. My only laptops have been tiny netbooks chosen for low price and light weight, and at the time AMD did not have anything in that market. Now they do, at a moderate price penalty but better performance. The only Intel desktops I have worked with have been random source used ones given to me/belonging to friends/from the dumpster. Any new desktop stuff has always been AMD.

You realise that Foxconn manufacture most of the motherboards in the world right? Not just Intel, not just Apple.... They manufacture for everyone because they offer the cheapest workers, and they keep their name off the products they make.

[CTown]

I can't stand Apple's association with Foxconn (home of worker suicides at their mainland China plant), their dedication to closed ecosystems, or their pricing. As such, it does not matter to me if an Apple product is technically superior to what I am considering, as the Apple product essentially does not exist to me. My only laptops have been tiny netbooks chosen for low price and light weight, and at the time AMD did not have anything in that market. Now they do, at a moderate price penalty but better performance. The only Intel desktops I have worked with have been random source used ones given to me/belonging to friends/from the dumpster. Any new desktop stuff has always been AMD.

I get what you are saying. It's terrible how these tech companies get away with these crimes overseas. It's also unfortuante how much the tech community is involved in lobbying. Still, I'm saying I have no idea what contenders in the ultrabook (or ultrathin) class use AMD (not looking for a superior product but a product).

Also, what type of electronics can someone who avoids Foxconn buy?

Plenty of folks say the holocaust didn't happen (or wasn't as bad as the many, many, many first-hand accounts have said).
To call Gaza a "concentration camp" is to render that phrase meaningless.
Just to curtail any further digressions, I believe that a two-state solution is the only ethical solution. That, and probably reparations for the Palastinian's displacement.

I hear you on that. In fact, I have even met people who claim that the holocaust was exaggerated; without documentation. Also, you can't keep people concentrated in one area with virtually no resources and not call it an concentration camp... that's a terrible use of semantics. Not to mention that thousands of people are wiped out every now and then. Unfortunately, I doubt the two-state solution. Israel wants to mold the identity of the West Bank using its settlements... I don't even want to point out the effect that can have.

[nanonyme]

I get what you are saying. It's terrible how these tech companies get away with these crimes overseas. It's also unfortuante how much the tech community is involved in lobbying. Still, I'm saying I have no idea what contenders in the ultrabook (or ultrathin) class use AMD (not looking for a superior product but a product).

Also, what type of electronics can someone who avoids Foxconn buy?



I hear you on that. In fact, I have even met people who claim that the holocaust was exaggerated; without documentation. Also, you can't keep people concentrated in one area with virtually no resources and not call it an concentration camp... that's a terrible use of semantics. Not to mention that thousands of people are wiped out every now and then. Unfortunately, I doubt the two-state solution. Israel wants to mold the identity of the West Bank using its settlements... I don't even want to point out the effect that can have.

The important difference is Palestinians afaik aren't prevented from leaving but more encouraged to do it. Hence more about imperialistic colonization, less about concentration camps.

[CTown]

The important difference is Palestinians afaik aren't prevented from leaving but more encouraged to do it. Hence more about imperialistic colonization, less about concentration camps.

It's not that easy. Look at this article from a Jewish website (to avoid a pro-Palestinian bias). Even the one free sentence explains it all. One must sneak out of Gaza. Also, those going to Europe never had a 100% chance to find a home there.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/.premium-1.616162

[Luke]

Foxconn does have competitors

You realise that Foxconn manufacture most of the motherboards in the world right? Not just Intel, not just Apple.... They manufacture for everyone because they offer the cheapest workers, and they keep their name off the products they make.

Desktop motherboards can be obtained from companes that directly compete with Foxconn, such as Gigabyte. If you build your own hardware, you can bypass the worst component suppliers. To me that means Intel and Foxconn.

In this article http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/30...xconn-gigabyte a commentor calls Gigabyte a clear winner over Foxconn for "employee longevity." Probably the same is true of all the other Taiwanese motherboard companies that still use the chain of factories on Tiawan instead of moving to mainland China like Foxconn did. Asustek, Gigabyte, ASRock, MSI, and Biostar are all based in Tiawan. I think Foxconn started out there but moved to mainland China to save money at the price or worker's rights, health, and safety. I've only seen Foxconn mentioned in stories about worker suicides at gated and fenced in factory/housing complexes!

When you get motherboards in the box at a computer store, you probably won't even see Foxconn offered, and the boards come with overclocking firmware to boot and probably will always come with unlocked/unlockable boot firmware.

Foxconn is a big OEM supplier, in general I would advise to use desktops as much as possible for power hardware as you can build them yourself and avoid problematic suppliers. Mobile hardware has so many problems ranging from Congolese coltan used in tantalum capacitors to fabs like Foxconn that best advice is to buy used or as infrequently as possible, rather like buying clothing in that respect.

[Forge]

This is a pure speculation. I guess NVIDIA has nothing against redistributing firmware blobs (after all NVIDIA drivers can be freely downloaded). It's just crazy open source fanatics who hate firmware.



That makes perfect sense. Modern GPUs are no longer just stupid video cards - they are computational processors which can perform many different operations beyond just computing geometry and then applying T&L, e.g. GPUs can work with system memory more or less directly, just like CPUs, so it makes sense to verify firmware to avoid nasty things which NVIDIA cannot control.

Besides firmware might control many crucial things like voltages, fans, etc., so this way NVIDIA guarantees that its products won't be misused and won't die due to some open source developer mistake. NVIDIA can employ hundreds of people to do proper QC & QA which is unheard of in the Linux world.



How so?

Michael, don't be a fanatic.

Troll, your bridge is unattended. None of the other complex "computational processors" in my PCs require a binary blob to work. In fact, with Intel and AMD's CPUs, that would be a nasty catch-22, since there's nothing to load any binary blob before the CPU is running. Nvidia: DO NOT WANT. Do not attempt to pollute FOSS projects with closed binaries, kkthx.

[Gusar]

Troll, your bridge is unattended.

You should really be careful before saying things like that. Because...

None of the other complex "computational processors" in my PCs require a binary blob to work.

But of course they do. It's just that one version is already on the CPU, which is how the catch-22 is avoided. But one can optionally load a newer version every boot, in Linux this is done using the microcode module if you have intel-ucode/amd-ucode packages (distros might name these differently) installed.

Do not attempt to pollute FOSS projects with closed binaries, kkthx.

So, I figure you never use wireless. Or wired for that matter, as at least Realtek NICs use firmware too. Like with CPUs, these NICs already contain a version of the firmware, but the driver will attempt to load newer versions that are distributed in the linux-firmware package.

Bottom line - FOSS is already very much "polluted" with closed binaries, so singling out one particular company is silly, especially when you start your post with accusations of trolling.

[System25]

But of course they do. It's just that one version is already on the CPU, which is how the catch-22 is avoided. But one can optionally load a newer version every boot, in Linux this is done using the microcode module if you have intel-ucode/amd-ucode packages (distros might name these differently) installed.

Actually, updating uCode in CPU is quite optional - CPU supposed to work out of the box. Sure, it can fix some bugs but actually most CPUs would run okay without doing so.

So, I figure you never use wireless. Or wired for that matter, as at least Realtek NICs use firmware too. Like with CPUs, these NICs already contain a version of the firmware, but the driver will attempt to load newer versions that are distributed in the linux-firmware package.

Wireless varies wildly. Say, most of PCI and PCI-E Atheros-based .n devices would not requre any external firmware blobs. Also, Atheros based "carl9170" USB devices are unique in sense they have opensource firmware.

And when it comes to wired, most devices do not need firmware at all. Most of Realtek ICs as well. Some few ICs actually take some small firmware though, but I would rather call it exception than usual state of things.

Bottom line - FOSS is already very much "polluted" with closed binaries

It is really nice to clean up all that crap as much as we can. Surprise, surprise.